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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hello,

I've been pretty excited about the ID.4, but this dealer process is making it harder to shop for than an actual car. In any case I've been calling various dealers in my area (Northern NJ) and they all seem to charge the BS dealer fee, one even slapped on a $350 etching fee.

What would be the best strategy here, just go to the lowest fee dealer and get it over with or negotiate a dealer against another? Overall this whole dealer haggling makes me very uncomfortable. Thank you for any suggestions
 

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ID.4 1st Edition
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It really is a shame that the "horse trading" paradigm still exists (evidenced by 20 pages thus far in the linked "shenanigans" thread). Other than the destination fee that we all pay, and of course sales taxes if applicable in your locale, plus Registration/Title, there shouldn't be any others. btw: I paid $135 for Registration & Title but that was it in terms of "other" fees. But then states can control, or not, such fees.

So do call around and just go with the lowest price.
Fortunately many of us had a no stress transaction, so those too do exist.


Some other excellent insight: Purchasing Best Practices - How To Pay No More Than MSRP
 

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It can be difficult to get around dealer "document" fees. They can range all over the place in NJ. My experience is that $350 is on the lower side. I have seen ( but not paid) them up to $750. Any dealer that tries to charge for an etching fee is told I will not pay for it. I believe in PA, the document fees are fixed/regulated by the state.
 

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2021 ID.4 First Edition (Dusk Blue)
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Does your state limit doc fees? Here in IL they're limited to 300$ and good luck getting them taken off. It's basically not worth the hassle.

I'd NOPE a $350 etching fee for sure tho.
 

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ID.4 1st Edition White / Lunar Grey
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You can buy out of state. I've only bought used out of state, but there's no reason not to.

As an "on the lot" ID.4 shopper, you're at the mercy of market demand at the moment. If the buyer behind your is willing to pay the mark-up, you've got no leverage.

On the other hand, if you establish contacts at a bunch of dealers and trade text messages every few days, making it known what you'll pay, one of the will (probably) eventually bite.

I would also make it known that you're shopping outside the area. Some dealers are trying to outlast you, but if they know they may lose the sale, they may be more interested in getting another one off their books.

Really, the big unknown is how quickly these are moving off the lot, particularly at exaggerated prices.

Is airfare and an 8 hour road trip to Ohio worth it to you? I've done similar trips to Phoenix, Salt Lake City, and Pasadena, and made a fun (but long) day out of it.
 

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2021 ID.4 First Edition (Dusk Blue)
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Doesn't NJ have a $5k rebate coming online in July? I don't know if you'd be eligible for the rebate if you buy out of state, but if not the easy answer is to suck up a $500 fee or whatever in order to get the $5k back.
 

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for those who haven't signed on the dotted line of a sales contract, check out Kevin Hunter "The Homework Guy" on youtube. fun content while u learn.
 

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You can buy out of state. I've only bought used out of state, but there's no reason not to.

As an "on the lot" ID.4 shopper, you're at the mercy of market demand at the moment. If the buyer behind your is willing to pay the mark-up, you've got no leverage.

On the other hand, if you establish contacts at a bunch of dealers and trade text messages every few days, making it known what you'll pay, one of the will (probably) eventually bite.

I would also make it known that you're shopping outside the area. Some dealers are trying to outlast you, but if they know they may lose the sale, they may be more interested in getting another one off their books.

Really, the big unknown is how quickly these are moving off the lot, particularly at exaggerated prices.

Is airfare and an 8 hour road trip to Ohio worth it to you? I've done similar trips to Phoenix, Salt Lake City, and Pasadena, and made a fun (but long) day out of it.
This is the winner.

I contacted multiple dealerships through AutoTrader dot com, and kept in touch via email. When one finally had the car I wanted, we did all of the haggling over email. Before I went the 250 miles to pick up my ID.4, I insisted on a copy of the buyer's order, listing all of the charges. I also backed that up with "if I write you a check for this amount, I drive away with the car, right?"

Of course they can back out or try some shenanigans even after that. But I had the whole thing done - including a trade-in offer - before I ever left the house. I've done this twice now (once without a trade).

Remember that you are NOT in a hurry. Remind them that you are happy going up to 500 miles away or more to pick up your car if they give you static - remember that it's free electricity on the way back!

And here I'll plug Clay Cooley VW in Dallas. Truly a hassle-free and nice experience. No tricks, no extra charges. It's far for OP, but if you're in the area give them a call. If you PM me I'll give you the name of the people I dealt with.
 

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2021 VW ID.4 FE
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When I purchased my FE 3 weeks ago, I decided I'd accept the dealer's $695 documentation fee. It's on the high side but is not regulated in TN. However, I balked on them charging me $90 for "business tax". They told me that they charge everyone this, but I told them "since I'm not a 'business', I will not pay a 'business tax' ".
 

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Other than the destination fee that we all pay, and of course sales taxes if applicable in your locale, plus Registration/Title, there shouldn't be any others. btw: I paid $135 for Registration & Title but that was it in terms of "other" fees. But then states can control, or not, such fees.
Indirectly, anything, even destination fee, even sales tax, can be deducted from the starting price. I've never gone into a negotiation with a rigid assumption of any particular fee. I just offer a certain first check and certain monthly payments. With a lease I add the additional consideration of trying to get a lower buyout price (by asking for a low MF and/or high RV).
 

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ID.4 1st Edition White / Lunar Grey
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Indirectly, anything, even destination fee, even sales tax, can be deducted from the starting price. I've never gone into a negotiation with a rigid assumption of any particular fee. I just offer a certain first check and certain monthly payments. With a lease I add the additional consideration of trying to get a lower buyout price (by asking for a low MF and/or high RV).
That's not a bad approach, I like it. "I want to pay you this much." It doesn't matter how things are itemized on the sales contract, just get me there. Not monthlies, just the bottom like price on the contract.
 

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ID.4 1st Edition
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Not sure why you cherry picked that portion of my response to go off on an "anything is negotiable" tangent. I've taken the typical corporate courses on same and in principle yes everything is negotiable. Of course for those of us who ordered First Editions we knew MSRP plus Destination were hardlined. We could have simply walked away (btw: always the best tactic at dealerships, even if only feigned).

Mathematically of course if you can reduce the sales price you pay lower sales tax. But short of somehow thereafter getting the dealership to pay the tax in your stead no way out of it, at least not in Taxachusetts. Same goes for the RMV and their Registration/Title fee.

Basically I was trying to convey that there Shouldn't be any fees aside from those I stated. However I also recognize that some states have other fees, cap certain fees, whereas others let the market bear what it will.

Indirectly, anything, even destination fee, even sales tax, can be deducted from the starting price. I've never gone into a negotiation with a rigid assumption of any particular fee. I just offer a certain first check and certain monthly payments. With a lease I add the additional consideration of trying to get a lower buyout price (by asking for a low MF and/or high RV).
 

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ID.4 1st Edition White / Lunar Grey
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Of course they can back out or try some shenanigans even after that. But I had the whole thing done - including a trade-in offer - before I ever left the house. I've done this twice now (once without a trade).

...remember that it's free electricity on the way back!
The worst "shenanigans" I had to deal with was flying down to SoCal to buy my wife's Dieselgate replacement Volvo. Volvo had a special promo for 0% and 5 years free maintenance. I went over all of this with the salesman. But when I flew down to pick it up, the finance person had no knowledge of this program, and they hadn't even qualified me yet. She had to call back to New Jersey to get a bunch of clarification, and I think I wasted three hours in what should have been a simple in-and-out transaction. At least they didn't play games with the negotiated price or hard selling any extras.

But shoot, every other out-of-are transaction has been great. It seems like a risk -- there's nothing binding and they know you've just paid to get there, but so far everyone has been honorable in keeping to terms agreed to before hand.

Your "free fuel" comment reminded me of our Phoenix trip to pick up my wife's first TDI, an used 06 Jetta. Driving home, probably still in Arizona, pulling into a truck-stop style gas island where it's all diesel and big rigs, where there's a left and a right gas pump at each position for left and right tanks, dwarfed in our teeny tiny Jetta, and being told "You're in the wrong place!" and my wife with her smug reply, "It's diesel!"
 

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....

Basically I was trying to convey that there Shouldn't be any fees aside from those I stated. However I also recognize that some states have other fees, cap certain fees, whereas others let the market bear what it will.
I'm just trying to convey that to anyone reading up on these comments with questions about fees, that it is useful to know what the "hard" items are, like Destination Fees and Sales Tax, as opposed to the "soft" fees that are laughable inventions made up by Salesmen. Knowing the hard fees is useful because it lets you determine what your maximum offer should (or could) be.
Once you know what the hard fees are and what you're willing to offer, the soft fees are 100 percent irrelevant.
EDIT to add: Actually, it's not just the soft fees that become irrelevant once you've determined an offer. EVERYTHING becomes irrelevant.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
I am speaking to one dealership trying to get an Out the Door price and they are insisting they need to know if I am financing or not. The reason they say...."because of the tax credits are applied differently". I'm in NJ, and not sure what they are trying to pull here.


I'm just trying to convey that to anyone reading up on these comments with questions about fees, that it is useful to know what the "hard" items are, like Destination Fees and Sales Tax, as opposed to the "soft" fees that are laughable inventions made up by Salesmen. Knowing the hard fees is useful because it lets you determine what your maximum offer should (or could) be.
Once you know what the hard fees are and what you're willing to offer, the soft fees are 100 percent irrelevant.
EDIT to add: Actually, it's not just the soft fees that become irrelevant once you've determined an offer. EVERYTHING becomes irrelevant.
 

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Not free, but does remind me of the time I helped my buddy buy his Golf TDI in AZ and on the way back we were laughing because diesel was 2.35/gallon compared to our $5/gallon back in CA.
 

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I am speaking to one dealership trying to get an Out the Door price and they are insisting they need to know if I am financing or not. The reason they say...."because of the tax credits are applied differently". I'm in NJ, and not sure what they are trying to pull here.
That dealer's question is actually perfectly legitimate if they're trying to finance in-house. They need a total revenue. If they yield a little on the car but make it up on financing, they can accept the deal, as opposed to rejecting the deal if they're not making anything on finance.
It's up to you to determine if their finance offer is good for you, and also if you don't like their loan, you can accept it temporarily and later transfer the loan to your own loan. Just make sure there's no fee for exiting their loan early. The dealer could care less if you end up doing that, as they already made their "points" in getting the loan initiated.
 
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