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Pedestrian warning sound at 71 dB is louder than necessary

We have had several posts here claiming that the pedestrian warning sound of the ID4 is loud, and I agree. So I broke out my trusty sound pressure meter and took a quick reading as my wife was backing out of the garage. We didn't reach the loudest level I have ever heard from the car (I think)...

www.vwidtalk.com

 

are you talking about the noise maker below 25MPH so you don't run over pedestrians? If so, you have to disable that with a jumper resistor, there are postings around this either here or another forum. I remember seeing one, but I also think that there is also a speaker in the front. Both of them are under the car.

I knew somebody would post the link, thanks @SunWizard

 

Wow, that was fast, thanks both of you! Super helpful.

are you talking about the noise maker below 25MPH so you don't run over pedestrians?

That must be what it is, but I didn't realize that's what it was for. The salesperson had no clue what it was or how to turn it off.

I'll pay attention tomorrow to double-check, but it definitely modulates volume with speed, so this checks.

 

It never ceases to amaze and depress me how little most vehicle salespeople, of any brand, know about the products they're selling. 😔

Thankfully I guess he didn't know as you can't, and shouldn't, turn it off.

As you'll note in the above-linked discussion some of us have a relatively low volume sound. Likely varying vendor lots of parts that just-meet the low end of the specified dB range. My wife and I like the sound as well when pulling into the garage as apropos The Jetsons reminiscent.

...The salesperson had no clue what it was or how to turn it off.

 

My question is the opposite: is there a way to make the spaceship sound louder? I live in a small-ish town where many streets don’t have sidewalks, so people (kids etc.) walk in the street. I drive pretty slowly on these streets, esp when there are pedestrians around, but I still sometimes seem to sneak up on people. So better too loud than too soft. Plus as sounds go, I personally think it’s pretty cool.

In any case, disabling the sound isn’t, and shouldn’t, be an option because it’s illegal and unsafe.

 

My question is the opposite: is there a way to make the spaceship sound louder? I live in a small-ish town where many streets don’t have sidewalks, so people (kids etc.) walk in the street. I drive pretty slowly on these streets, esp when there are pedestrians around, but I still sometimes seem to sneak up on people. So better too loud than too soft. Plus as sounds go, I personally think it’s pretty cool. In any case, disabling the sound isn’t, and shouldn’t, be an option because it’s illegal and unsafe.

I want an electric car because of no sound. I drive with radio off. My old prius did not make a sound amen. Nor do teslas amen 2. But my ID4…. i hate it. I like the quietness as I can heard a dog barg or the ambient noise of the world … it gives me a better 3D space awareness when I can hear other people wtc talking. Cars make noise naturally even with no engine on.Make the user choose.

 

This is a safety requirement in the US after a certain date of manufacture, not sure what that date is at the moment. And if the manufacturer allowed any kind of “adjustment” they get in lots of trouble and end in a recall. See Tesla and boom box mode. Any time a “feature” gets categorized as safety, a lot of the decision making is stripped from the oem. Think back, backup cameras were a luxury. Now, as of 2016, any vehicle produced for the US market MUST have some form of backup safety device installed from the factory. Be it chirping alarms or a full fledged camera.
this is no different. And it is also meant to keep blind pedestrians safe as they can (obviously) not see the car and without these ambient sound generators, they would have an extremely difficult time hearing them also.
Im sure Daredevil would have no problem but it’s for the greater good.

 

If your state requires ongoing safety inspections and you disable them, you're also likely to fail said inspection. Actually think the cutoff is 20 MPH, at least that's where is seems to be our brand new one.

 

As the initiator of the linked thread and having an ax to grind about how loud my ID4 is, let me state for the record that VW's sound, and especially how they vary the sound in pitch and loudness, works really well to discern that
a) there is a vehicle
b) it is speeding up, or
c) it is slowing down
I think it is better than many others I have observed and heard, except for the excessive volume in at least some of the ID4s. Also, the legal cutoff is 30 km/h, which equates to 18 mph.

 

There seems to be some misinformation about the ID4's slow speed sound. It is a federal government requirement for manufactures to include this on the vehicle. But as far as the research I have done it is not illegal for the owner of the vehicle to modify this sound. Just like it is not illegal to cut off the tags on a pillow. But if a hearing impaired person came in contact with your vehicle because you eliminated the sound you may be in trouble. Personally, I think the sound is obnoxious but I rarely have the windows down so I can not hear it inside the vehicle.

 

People should do their own research.

For the US at least, car certifications, and safety inspections are a state by state issue. You should review your state's laws to determine if there is any liability for disabling a safety system for your own safety inspections (if required).

A the US Federal level, certainly NHSTA says no manufacturer or entity subject to NHSTA review is allowed to provide for the modification, removal, etc. of such devices. I suspect that no reputable nationwide brand auto repair shop would do it, as you mention for the liability exposure alone, regardless of exposure to NHSTA oversight or not. Your shade tree mechanic might not have such qualms depending on your local.

And certainly owners are allowed to do whatever they want, again within the limits of whatever their state law requires. If you hurt someone due to disabling it, you'd most likely be tried under state law anyhow, as I doubt the Federal government would attempt to assert any jurisdiction over a singular vehicular indicident.

Excerpt from FMVSS no 141 Federal Register :: Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standard No. 141, Minimum Sound Requirements for Hybrid and Electric Vehicles

For folks outside the US, where they are subject to usually much more stringent annual or bi-annual inspection, you should consult your local standards there as well.

 

“So, Mr. VW Dave, and remember you’re under oath, isn’t it true that you willfully and deliberately disabled this federally mandated safety feature, leading to a collision with my client who is blind, leaving him paralyzed and wheelchair-bound for the rest of his life?”

It could happen. In fact it probably will, just not to me. 😬

 

And remember don't eat peanuts!!!
If and only if parents would let their kids at the age of one play with free range farm chickens and pigs, surely a few of them would die from some disease… but the ones that survived will be able to eat peanuts as their imune system is not as spottly clean as the urban condo downtown kid who thinks chicken grows in trees… well they do sleep up trees at night for safety…

point being too much regulation and in my case the noise makes me sick and following all your thoughts process I will have work related (driving) injuries from this constant wabble jetson noise.

 

Anyone knows If It is possible to modify the sound?

 

Some have done it. You will have to look elsewhere for how to do it.

 

Manufactures should provide such safety devices to all vehicles. But users should be allowed to change and modify. Similarly we cant use ‘video’ on our entertainment system… yet we should have an option to agree to be responsible for using such video. It would be safer than hanging my phone so I can see video as I drive - in my case mostly podcasts but sometimes the show “the Profit”….

 

Manufactures should provide such safety devices to all vehicles. But users should be allowed to change and modify. Similarly we cant use ‘video’ on our entertainment system… yet we should have an option to agree to be responsible for using such video. It would be safer than hanging my phone so I can see video as I drive - in my case mostly podcasts but sometimes the show “the Profit”….

Unless I missing the sarcasm your comments kind of make it obvious why some features are locked…. Because watching videos while driving is the responsible thing to do….

sigh.

 

I’m not 100% sure this is serious but here it is.

NHTSA May Require PWS to Be Retrofitted on All Electric Vehicles

The National Highway Transportation Safety Administration (NHTSA) is investigating whether EVs from 1997 to present should use external speakers.

www.notateslaapp.com

The National Highway Transportation Safety Administration (NHTSA) is investigating whether hybrid-electric and electric vehicles from 1997 to present should have external speakers installed for pedestrian safety. The investigation was officially opened on January 27th, according to Teslarati.

In 2018, Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standard (FMVSS) 141 passed. This new safety standard required electric vehicles and hybrid-electric vehicles with a weight of 10,000 pounds (4,536 kilograms) or less to have a pedestrian warning system (PWS). A PWS is an external speaker on the vehicle that plays a sound when the vehicle is traveling at low speeds. This ensures pedestrians can hear vehicles if they’re nearby.

 

It would not surprise me that they might try to make manufactures do it retroactively.

As to Andre’s comments about other cars not having them, if you bought a new one of any of those cars they to would have a sound generator. They were not required in the US until like 2019 or 2020. Europe was earlier.

Also, and while I get that you are being somewhat sarcastic about chickens and peanuts, I learned the hard way when my mom passed away many years ago now that growing up on a farm around animals can lead to long term undiagnosed issues that come back to be major issues later in life. MSN

 

Related to the above: Teslas currently only play a sound in reverse as factory default. It wouldn't surprise me if the feds forced Tesla to change that setting, and slapped them with a fine for knowingly disregarding FMVSS 141.

I still think VW went overboard with their implementation of FMVSS 141 requirements. Great sound and very good relative awareness of what the car is doing, but way louder than required.

It would not surprise me that they might try to make manufactures do it retroactively.

 

The car does have other tools. If the PWS doesn't get their attention you can use the horn, steering, brakes or accelerator.... not necessarily in that order.

 

If somebody hit me or a family member in a parking lot and they had disabled a safety device I would certainly look into suing them into the next century.