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Charging Slow at Electrify America

20764 Views 226 Replies 50 Participants Last post by FromSunSoCal, 8 d ago

Mike26

Discussion Starter · Jan 29, 2022

I have been charging at Electrify America since beginning of December. The charging time is excessive compared to that specified by VW.

I have used 3 different charging stations, and I am getting between 50-70 kWh, although the chargers supposedly can deliver 150 kWh, and I believe the ID4 is capable of receiving 125 kWh.

It takes me more than an hour to charge the car. I have contacted Electrify America, asking following questions:
1) Is this due to a fault with the car? Answer was "likely not".
2) Is the "free charging" arrangement with VW based on a reduced charging rate? Answer was "no".
3) Is there a general problem with the charging stations? Answer was "maybe with some of the stations".

They have put in work orders on all 3 charging stations (yeah right), as they believe it's due to their stations not delivering enough power. This however seems unlikely.

Obviously this is a systemic issue. I have not tried other companies, but I am curious as to what other people are experiencing.

I guess next step would be a complaint to VW, as the car is not charging in the specified time, which is about 35 minutes, but in about an hour and 10 minutes. And I wonder if Tesla and other EV brands have the same issues.

I understand that cold weather plays a role, but December was not that cold (40s, 50s). Today was around 30F.

Comments appreciated.

On a separate note, when the car is 100% charged, it says 200 miles as the range. Isn't it supposed to be 250 miles?

1 - 20 of 227 Posts

SunWizard

· #2 · Jan 29, 2022

Slow charging is due to the battery being cold and the BMS limits the DCFC and amount of regen:

SunWizard said:
When cold the DCFC is reduced and the waste heat from driving does not warm the battery much beyond 46F where the battery heater shuts off:
At 32F (0C) max out at 50kw
At 54F (12°C) battery it will max out 65Kw
63F (17°C) it will go up to 100+Kw
68F (20°C) will deliver max output if EA is actually capable delivering rated power on the box

This thread has many people confirming these temps but note many people confuse ambient temps with battery temps. If you don't have a dongle, assume your battery temps are close to your overnight low temps if your car is sitting outside, unless your heater has come on at temps above. See:

Cold weather and charging

Hi all, Quick question, in colder weather should I expect reduced charging speeds at EA fast chargers? I've noticed that when I've gone to EA chargers my charging speeds are much slower than normal and when I've charged its not been below 40 degrees. I tried moving to a different charger and...

www.vwidtalk.com

Reactions: 5

Mike26

Discussion Starter · #3 · Jan 29, 2022

SunWizard said:
Slow charging is due to the battery being cold and the BMS limits the DCFC and amount of regen:

Wow! I wish they would tell you that when you buy the car.
So what happens when temperatures drop below 32F?? I live in Chicago.

Reactions: 1

Manybees

· #4 · Jan 29, 2022

Mike26 said:
Wow! I wish they would tell you that when you buy the car.

From the VW ID.4 web page, “Actual mileage and range will vary and depend on several factors including driving and charging habits, extreme hot or cold weather temperatures, battery age, and vehicle condition.” Is there something else they could’ve said?

Reactions: 2

SunWizard

· #5 · Jan 29, 2022

<0F when parked the battery heater will run, how often depends on SOC. In chicago this may need watching.
<32F when plugged in, heater runs
<46F when driving, battery heater runs

Reactions: 1

id4alex

· #6 · Jan 29, 2022

Manybees said:
From the VW ID.4 web page, “Actual mileage and range will vary and depend on several factors including driving and charging habits, extreme hot or cold weather temperatures, battery age, and vehicle condition.” Is there something else they could’ve said?

Yes, they could give the numbers and educate potential customers better. I do not consider 32F extreme cold temperature and certainly not 54F. I'm glad we have this forum and contributors like @SunWizard to explain details and set expectations but most consumers are not going to know this..

Reactions: 2

Ekroy

· #7 · Jan 29, 2022

Charge at home and then you don't have to worry about it. It's the way to go...

Reactions: 4

Ben V

· #8 · Jan 29, 2022

Mike26 said:
I have been charging at Electrify America since beginning of December. The charging time is excessive compared to that specified by VW.

I have used 3 different charging stations, and I am getting between 50-70 kWh, although the chargers supposedly can deliver 150 kWh, and I believe the ID4 is capable of receiving 125 kWh.

It takes me more than an hour to charge the car. I have contacted Electrify America, asking following questions:
1) Is this due to a fault with the car? Answer was "likely not".
2) Is the "free charging" arrangement with VW based on a reduced charging rate? Answer was "no".
3) Is there a general problem with the charging stations? Answer was "maybe with some of the stations".

They have put in work orders on all 3 charging stations (yeah right), as they believe it's due to their stations not delivering enough power. This however seems unlikely.

Obviously this is a systemic issue. I have not tried other companies, but I am curious as to what other people are experiencing.

I guess next step would be a complaint to VW, as the car is not charging in the specified time, which is about 35 minutes, but in about an hour and 10 minutes. And I wonder if Tesla and other EV brands have the same issues.

I understand that cold weather plays a role, but December was not that cold (40s, 50s). Today was around 30F.

Comments appreciated.

On a separate note, when the car is 100% charged, it says 200 miles as the range. Isn't it supposed to be 250 miles?

I get about 3.4 miles/kWh which makes a range of 262 miles. I almost exclusively charge with EA and usually get around 125kW to start which then drops down to 65 ish by the time the car is at 80%. USually I charge from 15'ish % to 80% which takes around 30 mins.

Reactions: 1

VW TECHNICIAN

· #9 · Jan 29, 2022

My advice is try to follow me and other members posting on this forum ....and start reading . ...you will learn a lot what you facing now.... There is need to change your expectations from what you have learned living with ICE vehicles and focus on learning how to live with EV. @SunWizard is another great member that have been very helpful to many forum members. Good luck.

Reactions: 5

ohioid4driver2022

· #10 · Jan 29, 2022

SunWizard said:
Slow charging is due to the battery being cold and the BMS limits the DCFC and amount of regen:

Seems that preconditioning the ID4 battery en route to charging like Tesla does would sure help a lot of people out. But this would require people using built in nav so the car knew you were going to charge at x point

Reactions: 5

jgoodnough

· #11 · Jan 29, 2022

Mike26 said:
Wow! I wish they would tell you that when you buy the car.
So what happens when temperatures drop below 32F?? I live in Chicago.

I charged at an EA station the other day after a 45 minute drive. The temp was around 22°F. I was getting between 62 and 64kW for the entire charge. I started at 22% SOC and ended at about 60%. The EA charger had to be as cold as it gets since the early morning temp. that day was around -2°F.

Reactions: 3

Cms3717

· #12 · Jan 29, 2022

I saw a youtube video that the method at which you start the charging can sometimes effect the charge rate. They suggested rather than following the instructions on the charge station. Initiate the charging through the APP first BEFORE plugging in the car. Not sure if will help, but worth a try?

Reactions: 2

jgoodnough

· #13 · Jan 29, 2022

Cms3717 said:
I saw a youtube video that the method at which you start the charging can sometimes effect the charge rate. They suggested rather than following the instructions on the charge station. Initiate the charging through the APP first BEFORE plugging in the car. Not sure if will help, but worth a try?

That's precisely what the EA rep told me when I called them once before. Start the App, find and select the charger, then plug-in, then swipe to start the charge. The one thing I still always have to do is click "continue" on the charger screen. It doesn't always step past that automatically.

Reactions: 1

PANZERidIV

· #14 · Jan 29, 2022

The fine print will get you every time! I am sure we are going to be hearing the first reports of trying to charge at EA during a Bomb Cyclone and owners in Florida telling of slow charging as they are having the coldest temperatures in over a decade. A good weekend to drive the 12-cylinder Ferrari instead!

sirozha

· #15 · Jan 30, 2022

Mike26 said:
Wow! I wish they would tell you that when you buy the car.
So what happens when temperatures drop below 32F?? I live in Chicago.

In the winter, you start driving your ICEV unless you have a garage where you can charge overnight.

Reactions: 1

EVone

· #16 · Jan 30, 2022

Ben V said:
I get about 3.4 miles/kWh which makes a range of 262 miles. I almost exclusively charge with EA and usually get around 125kW to start which then drops down to 65 ish by the time the car is at 80%. USually I charge from 15'ish % to 80% which takes around 30 mins.

Ben @ what temps are you getting 125?

jgoodnough

· #17 · Jan 30, 2022

Ben V said:
I get about 3.4 miles/kWh which makes a range of 262 miles. I almost exclusively charge with EA and usually get around 125kW to start which then drops down to 65 ish by the time the car is at 80%. USually I charge from 15'ish % to 80% which takes around 30 mins.

I was getting that too when the temps were around 75 to 80° in the northeast. I'm betting Ben lives in a southern or left coast climate.

Reactions: 1

BlueDH

· #18 · Jan 30, 2022 (Edited)

Cms3717 said:
I saw a youtube video that the method at which you start the charging can sometimes effect the charge rate. They suggested rather than following the instructions on the charge station. Initiate the charging through the APP first BEFORE plugging in the car. Not sure if will help, but worth a try?

For me, since early Dec, I haven't been able to charge > 50-70 kWh. I use EA and the EA app exclusively, 150 kWh and 350 kWh pedestals.
I can be driving > 45 mi @ 70 mph and still can't get better than 50-70 kWh charge starting at < 20% (45 mi) SOC.
I've started using Travel Assist on US1 (45 mph and traffic lights ) instead of I95 (65 mph), an extra 10 min of time to increase mi/kWh. Velocity definitely affects mi/kWh.
Total 11897 mi since Mar 2021, last 5687 mi 3.4 mi/kWh.
I wish the EA app would precondition the battery when navigating to an EA destination when using the EA app and the Vehicle>Data screen would show batt temp.
Does the Car-Net app precondition the battery?

Reactions: 1

id4alex

· #19 · Jan 30, 2022

BlueDH said:
For me, since early Dec, I haven't been able to charge > 50-70 kWh. I use EA and the EA app exclusively, 150 kWh and 350 kWh pedestals.
I can be driving > 45 mi @ 70 mph and still can't get better than 50-70 kWh charge starting at < 20% (45 mi) SOC.
I've started using Travel Assist on US1 (45 mph and traffic lights ) instead of I95 (65 mph), an extra 10 min of time to increase mi/kWh. Velocity definitely affects mi/kWh.
Total 11897 mi since Mar 2021, last 5687 mi 3.4 mi/kWh.
I wish the EA app would precondition the battery when navigating to an EA destination when using the EA app and the Vehicle>Data screen would show batt temp.
Does the Car-Net app precondition the battery?

I think this post by @SunWizard summarizes everything that is known about this. He states battery < 46F when driving, the battery heater runs, but that's not enough to get it warm enough for faster charging. The hope is that the 3.0 software update (whenever that comes) will preheat batteries for fast charging when you use the navigation to go to an EA charger. So hopefully it will be better next winter!

VW TECHNICIAN

· #20 · Jan 31, 2022

id4alex said:
I think this post by @SunWizard summarizes everything that is known about this. He states battery < 46F when driving, the battery heater runs, but that's not enough to get it warm enough for faster charging. The hope is that the 3.0 software update (whenever that comes) will preheat batteries for fast charging when you use the navigation to go to an EA charger. So hopefully it will be better next winter!

This will be very important part of update and ability to preheat battery to optimal condition before hitting charging location. Short drives in cold weather will change battery management and stay away from heating up so there will be less energy lost and better efficiency in this scenario ( it may limit available SOC because battery is not in sweet temperature condition)...but longer drives will kick in onboard battery heater .

Reactions: 2

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