[currahee66]

I have a question. Living in WA state our electricity costs $0.076 KW/hr all throughout the day. There aren't any variations like in some states. Will it cost more to charge the ID 4 using an EVSE at 30 amp ( which I presently have via a NEMA 14-30) running at 25 mph as opposed to one with a higher amperage? Does charging faster equate to a lesser cost? I have all the time to charge overnight as I can get free charging at work and also at a 50 kwh Shell station.

 

[Nai3t]

No difference. You're just "filling the tank" so to speak, how fast you do it doesn't affect the "quantity" required.

There are some footnotes. Level 1 charging (120 volts) is about 10% less efficient than Level 2. And I've seen some folks make the case that Level 2 charging at a higher amperage could be slightly more efficient than at a lower amperage because the car's systems/cooling run for shorter amount of time, consuming less power, though this would be minimal.

Edit: One additional thought, not sure yet how this applies to the ID.4 as I'm unclear about battery preconditioning for set departure time. With my i3, which preconditions the battery for a set departure time, charging at a higher amperage in the 3 hours just before departure time warms the battery up as a byproduct of charging, whereas charging at a low rate relies entirely on the car's 1kW battery heater to kick on and do the job, and that heater can consume 3kWh of electricity over the course of 3 hours on a cold morning. The ID.4's battery heater consumes much more electricity (it draws around 5kW; not sure how long it needs to run). So potentially a higher rate charger will have a similar effect of not requiring additional heat to be created and externally induced, if the ID.4 actually preconditions based on a schedule.

 

[sprylo]

I have a question. Living in WA state our electricity costs $0.076 KW/hr all throughout the day. There aren't any variations like in some states. Will it cost more to charge the ID 4 using an EVSE at 30 amp ( which I presently have via a NEMA 14-30) running at 25 mph as opposed to one with a higher amperage? Does charging faster equate to a lesser cost? I have all the time to charge overnight as I can get free charging at work and also at a 50 kwh Shell station.

It's kWh (kilowatt × hour) not kW/h (kilowatt ÷ hour). Watt is a unit of power - energy per unit time - so when you multiply by time again, you get energy. Which is a hint to answer your question: you're charged for electricity in units of energy (kWh), so it doesn't matter how fast you use that energy, you'll pay the same. The only time that wouldn't be true is at a commercial charger where you pay by the minute rather than by the kilowatt.

If you compare to gasoline, for example, you're charged by the gallon. It doesn't matter if you fill your tank in 2 seconds, pit-stop style, or if it takes 10 minutes at one of those slow pumps that seem to click off every few seconds for no apparent reason. You pay for what goes in the tank, not how fast it gets there.

And that Shell station delivers 50 kW (not 50 kWh). If you could charge there for an hour and draw the full 50 kW the whole time, you'd get 50 kWh (50 kW × 1 h = 50 kWh).

Edit: Or, much more succinctly, what @Nai3t said.

 

[currahee66]

Thank you for clearing that up.

 

[Huey52]

Good discussion. I would only add that the cost of home electric charging still wows me (in a good way) compared to what I was spending on gasoline.

I often tease my wife with "well, I had to spend a whole $1.24 last night." 🤣 [albeit for 47 mi; ABC]

 

[Timbobh]

Yea I am really enjoying that the chargepoint app shows me how much money I spent charging my car. $4.32 for 128 miles last night. My 2004 Honda Accord that I traded in got ~32 mpg on the highway and gas is ~$3/gal in my area. How ridiculously different these costs are still gets me excited, haha.

 

[KB57]

Good discussion. I would only add that the cost of home electric charging still wows me (in a good way) compared to what I was spending on gasoline.

I often tease my wife with "well, I had to spend a whole $1.24 last night." 🤣 [albeit for 47 mi; ABC]

I agree totally, it has been really nice driving by gas stations and not having to fill up every 4 days for 32 bucks. Our cost is .03 cents a kwh so the cost to fill from 20% is around 1.90. Very nice.

 

[TPG]

I agree totally, it has been really nice driving by gas stations and not having to fill up every 4 days for 32 bucks. Our cost is .03 cents a kwh so the cost to fill from 20% is around 1.90. Very nice.

Only $0.03 / kWh? That's a great rate!
My cheapest off-peak rate is $0.18 / kWh and the peak rate is $0.50 / kWh (Northern California; Pacific Gas & Electric EV2 rate)
The peak $0.50 / kWh rate is like paying $4.50/gallon for gas.

 

[KB57]

Only $0.03 / kWh? That's a great rate!
My cheapest off-peak rate is $0.18 / kWh and the peak rate is $0.50 / kWh (Northern California; Pacific Gas & Electric EV2 rate)
The peak $0.50 / kWh rate is like paying $4.50/gallon for gas.

That’s our off peak time with the ev and solar rate. In Arizona

 

[ChristophW]

I pay nothing at all because we have enough solar panels on the roof. I sized the solar array by factoring in a future EV and conversion from natural gas heater and gas water heater to electric. Of course, there are the upfront cost and ROI considerations - I expect to break even in seven years, discounting the car purchase and heater (heat pump) purchase which we bought primarily for other reasons. It is very nice to reel in the cost-free and guilt-free miles.

 

[TPG]

I pay nothing at all because we have enough solar panels on the roof. I sized the solar array by factoring in a future EV and conversion from natural gas heater and gas water heater to electric. Of course, there are the upfront cost and ROI considerations - I expect to break even in seven years, discounting the car purchase and heater (heat pump) purchase which we bought primarily for other reasons. It is very nice to reel in the cost-free and guilt-free miles.

You must be seriously overproducing power if you pay net $0.00 per kWh.

I also have a solar PV system that was pretty cost-neutral when I installed it 8 years ago. Then the PG&E electric rates went up 3X and the TOU times changed so that almost all solar production is at low TOU rate times (12am - 3 pm on my EV plan). I have to charge my ID.4 during partial-peak or peak TOU times, so I have to pay PG&E for electricity even if my net usage is zero kWh over the true-up period.

Is this your situation too, or do you only charge your car when you have the same TOU rate as when you produce your power?

 

[KB57]

That’s our off peak time with the ev and solar rate. In Arizona

In Arizona you have to pay a flat rate of 32 dollars a month no matter what, they call it an administrator fee. Then you get 3.4 cents an kwh for what you solar produces and you pay 3.4 cents an hour for everything you solar doesn’t make up. Wish I would have gone with about 8 more panels. But what we have our total hours cost is around 60 a month. Not bad for Arizona heat

 

[gorj]

I am so lucky that an EA station is less than 10 minutes from my home right off an Interstate. So for the next three years I will not be using my L2 charger to much. And that station seems to work (most of the time)!

 

[TPG]

I am so lucky that an EA station is less than 10 minutes from my home right off an Interstate. So for the next three years I will not be using my L2 charger to much. And that station seems to work (most of the time)!

Using the EA station may be cheaper, but isn't it a lot more convenient to charge at home since you don't need to drive to the charger / wait to charge / drive home?

 

[KB57]

I am so lucky that an EA station is less than 10 minutes from my home right off an Interstate. So for the next three years I will not be using my L2 charger to much. And that station seems to work (most of the time)!

I have used EA many times on trips. They all have worked great for me.

Using the EA station may be cheaper, but isn't it a lot more convenient to charge at home since you don't need to drive to the charger / wait to charge / drive home?

my wife and I were just talking about how nice it is to just plug in at home in the evening and not having to worry about going to the station to fill up and at .03 cents a kwh doesn’t cost but 1.90 to charge it full

 

[dg4prez]

Damn, I pay $0.17/kwh. Still not terrible I suppose, but it's not free. I want solar but I'm not sure how I'd do in new england with a roof that faces WNW. No trees and coverage is basically all day on my hill, but still.

 

[dg4prez]

I am so lucky that an EA station is less than 10 minutes from my home right off an Interstate. So for the next three years I will not be using my L2 charger to much. And that station seems to work (most of the time)!

DC charging is going to put more wear on your battery than L2 charging would. Personally I'm avoiding it save for longer trips or need.

 

[ChristophW]

You must be seriously overproducing power if you pay net $0.00 per kWh.

I also have a solar PV system that was pretty cost-neutral when I installed it 8 years ago. Then the PG&E electric rates went up 3X and the TOU times changed so that almost all solar production is at low TOU rate times (12am - 3 pm on my EV plan). I have to charge my ID.4 during partial-peak or peak TOU times, so I have to pay PG&E for electricity even if my net usage is zero kWh over the true-up period.

Is this your situation too, or do you only charge your car when you have the same TOU rate as when you produce your power?

I have a house battery and can peak shift. Best decision I made for the solar system.
The battery carries us through most of the night unless we charge the car, which happens after midnight at the lowest TOU rate. There are still a few glitches to iron out (like fully reliable scheduled charging of the ID4), but overall I am net zero in terms of dollars at the moment (not counting the $10.58/month connection fee and tax). It helps that we currently don't drive much, and are close enough to the coast to not need A/C often.

 

[Froggy]

I use EA a lot. Basically I pass by it twice a week anyway. I also use my level 1 charger and covers my every day running around. Today I used free level 2 charging at a mall.
I purchased a Clippercreek level 2 and it arrived a week ago. Then I checked with my power company. They said that the underground distribution line to my house was a size 2 wire and that they would have to upgrade it to size 4 from the pedestal to the meter. $6 a foot with a 100 foot minimum charge. That is just to start. I will do it this year but only after hurricane season.

 

[TPG]

I have a house battery and can peak shift. Best decision I made for the solar system.
The battery carries us through most of the night unless we charge the car, which happens after midnight at the lowest TOU rate. There are still a few glitches to iron out (like fully reliable scheduled charging of the ID4), but overall I am net zero in terms of dollars at the moment (not counting the $10.58/month connection fee and tax). It helps that we currently don't drive much, and are close enough to the coast to not need A/C often.

That's the way to do it - congrats on the nice setup!