[ElectricBlue]

I had sent an email a few days ago to EA asking when their home unit might be available and got a call this morning saying it is. I checked their website and it is indeed available for ordering, $650.

I haven't heard of any advance units getting in the hands of the reviewers, so I don't know much about it. Seems to be a standard smart charger with no display other than blinky lights. They have had their installation manual posted for quite a while here:
Installation and Operations Manual

They are advertising a max of 40A service, so it can't feed the ID.4 at its maximum L2 rate. Has anyone heard any more details, or been able to get hands on?

BTW it does have an integrated GFCI capability, so there is a recommendation to hardwire or not use a GFCI breaker with it.

 

[Huey52]

Good info. Nice to have more options.

It was not necessary for me to install a GFCI breaker as my EVSE fell into the "dedicated use" category in my locale, in the same way as does a dryer. ChargePoint also recommended no GFCI as they had seen intermittent faults with same.

 

[stealthg]

Good info. Nice to have more options.

Agreed, especially since it seemed like there was a run on EVSE's for a while when the FE's finally made it into people's garages.

 

[tennr]

They are advertising a max of 40A service, so it can't feed the ID.4 at its maximum L2 rate.

In my opinion, this was miss on EA's part. For sure, this will be more than sufficient for many people since charging will happen overnight. But the fact that it CAN be hardwired, why limit to 40A?

If you want to reach the full charging potential of the ID.4 then you should seriously consider the ChargePoint Home Flex. I picked one up on Amazon for $699, it's an incredible device. Build quality is top notch, fully selectable max current all the way up to 80 amps, but you only need a 60 amp breaker to get full charging rate on the ID.4. In addition the charge handle lays nearly flat on the wall after its returned to the EVSE due to a pivot point. Not to mention full app support with notifications.

 

[ElectricBlue]

In my opinion, this was miss on EA's part. For sure, this will be more than sufficient for many people since charging will happen overnight. But the fact that it CAN be hardwired, why limit to 40A?

If you want to reach the full charging potential of the ID.4 then you should seriously consider the ChargePoint Home Flex. I picked one up on Amazon for $699, it's an incredible device. Build quality is top notch, fully selectable max current all the way up to 80 amps, but you only need a 60 amp breaker to get full charging rate on the ID.4. In addition the charge handle lays nearly flat on the wall after its returned to the EVSE due to a pivot point. Not to mention full app support with notifications.

I agree, especially since EA and VW should have had some good amount of coordination as this whole thing came together. One would have thought that the difference between 40 and 48 amp circuitry would not have been much of an impact to the design, unless they were saving time by borrowing from an existing one.

I have heard good things about the Chargepoint, although the scalpers at Amazon seem to have driven the price up to $1200+. You can go direct to their website where they are selling it for $699, but backordered. I think this was the EVSE level that EA should have been reaching for.

 

[Froggy]

One thing is that NEMA plugs ,which some are designed to use, are limited to 40 amp max. 48 amp have to have a hardwire connection. The difference between 40 and 48 overnight is minimal.

 

[tennr]

One thing is that NEMA plugs ,which some are designed to use, are limited to 40 amp max.

I've seen NEMA plugs go all the way up 60 amps. But in this case the EVSE we are comparing against is the new Electrify America version, and it comes with the 14-50, BUT it is also designed to be hardwired.

 

[JimmyVW]

Why the big focus on plugged vs hardwired? Aren’t you allowed to wire up your own equipment in the US? It’s not like you need to adapt your fusebox or something

personally I’d never go plugging something in that eats so many amps. To much chance of resistance build up and heat/fire risk over time for me

 

[Huey52]

USA hardwired 48A application requires a heavier gauge wire (usually 4-AWG), and metallic conduit (exposed spaces), which is quite expensive, especially if a long run is required. The 6-AWG required for a plug-in 40 amp flow is more common and no conduit required. Hence you see terms such as 6-50 & 14-50. The 60A breaker pair for hardwired is also more expensive than the 50A pair for plug-in.
Note that our Dryer and A/C compressor 240V wiring is typically 8-AWG and paired 30 & 25 breakers respectively.
Some homes/apartments have relatively limited panel capacity so yes that too can get expensive to upgrade. The voltage drop on a long run must also be evaluated.
In my case I ultimately considered the long term reliability of my EVSE. Although well rated I preferred to have a device I could swap out myself if necessary (actually I could swap out a hardwire myself, but plug just easier). I could also use the 6-50 socket for a welder, et al, although that would be contrary to the "dedicated use" that obviates a GFCI need.
A properly sized/insulated/installed 6/14-50 cable is no more risk of fire. In fact less so given lesser amperage.
Yes, we are allowed to do our own work .... to a point. Although I installed my own I still had a licensed electrician inspect and certify for insurance purposes. I didn't pull a permit however as all work within my structure. [I did pull a permit for my generator as it required exterior trenching. Having the town inspector certify served the same insurance purposes.]
The 40A vs. 48A is really negligible given an overnight charging session.

Why the big focus on plugged vs hardwired? Aren’t you allowed to wire up your own equipment in the US? It’s not like you need to adapt your fusebox or something.
Personally I’d never go plugging something in that eats so many amps. To much chance of resistance build up and heat/fire risk over time for me

 

[RichV]

I had sent an email a few days ago to EA asking when their home unit might be available and got a call this morning saying it is. I checked their website and it is indeed available for ordering, $650.

I haven't heard of any advance units getting in the hands of the reviewers, so I don't know much about it. Seems to be a standard smart charger with no display other than blinky lights. They have had their installation manual posted for quite a while here:
Installation and Operations Manual

They are advertising a max of 40A service, so it can't feed the ID.4 at its maximum L2 rate. Has anyone heard any more details, or been able to get hands on?

BTW it does have an integrated GFCI capability, so there is a recommendation to hardwire or not use a GFCI breaker with it.

Please be careful before starting to replace your 30amp circuit breakers with 40-50 amp breakers. I have 240 volts running into my garage to feed the electric dryer. Alas, it only has a 30 amp circuit breaker. I'm unable to install heavier duty breakers because the wiring is Romex 10-3. 10AWG wire is only rated to 30 amps max, 24 amps useable. If you're planning to run 40-50 amps on this cable, you stand a good chance of an electrical fire due to overheating the wire and insulation. Needless to say, I'm limited to only 24 amps on my L2 charger. This gets me 24 miles per hour of charge, which is more than enough to fully charge the battery overnight. Running a separate 40-50 amp line is not feasible in my case due to the location of my electrical panel being about 100' away from the garage. If your panel is in the garage (or nearby), you'll be able to run 6AWG or 8AWG cable very easily and install your 40 amp charger. Just be careful, 240 volts can kill.

 

[JimmyVW]

As a background:

No metal conduits needed in the Netherlands. Only a grounded metal jacket around the wire if the wire is ran outside/ in the ground. Anything after the circuit panel can be done yourself, as long as you adhere to code. Every circuit has a 16 amp breaker, and every phase is by default secured with 25a 240V Max Fuse.
You can get more, like 35a or 50a main fuses, but having this installed is significantly more expensive. Easily $1500 a year extra.

The 11kw home car chargers are 3 phase (3x 16amp) typically on their own circuit breakers. What I now have is a smart charger that integrates with the smart meter and keeps an eye on the load ove the main fuses. The charger will automatically lower the charge drawn if there is risk of drawing more than 25a (e.g. when cooking and charging at the same time, etc)

My charger also comes with an app that allows me to set the time the charge needs to be complete and then the power company can choose when to charge the car (e.g. 20 minutes every hours etc) to e.g. make sure we only charge when there is a surplus of “green electricity”

 

[Huey52]

Good Euro-info. Keep in mind that we in the USA are home-primarily 240VAC single phase with most of our circuits 120VAC 15/20A. Many older homes are still only 100A main panel service as well (or less; and therefore often relatively thinner gauge wires from the transformer). So installing an EVSE is more of an exercise for us.

As a background:

No metal conduits needed in the Netherlands. Only a grounded metal jacket around the wire if the wire is ran outside/ in the ground. Anything after the circuit panel can be done yourself, as long as you adhere to code. Every circuit has a 16 amp breaker, and every phase is by default secured with 25a 240V Max Fuse.
You can get more, like 35a or 50a main fuses, but having this installed is significantly more expensive. Easily $1500 a year extra.

The 11kw home car chargers are 3 phase (3x 16amp) typically on their own circuit breakers. What I now have is a smart charger that integrates with the smart meter and keeps an eye on the load ove the main fuses. The charger will automatically lower the charge drawn if there is risk of drawing more than 25a (e.g. when cooking and charging at the same time, etc)

My charger also comes with an app that allows me to set the time the charge needs to be complete and then the power company can choose when to charge the car (e.g. 20 minutes every hours etc) to e.g. make sure we only charge when there is a surplus of “green electricity”

 

[JimmyVW]

How do you guys get 240V? Is that the phase difference between two phases? Or is it a separate wire from the main transformer?

 

[Huey52]

As I said, Single phase in USA homes (multi-phase distribution but then only single phase to each home). We get two conductors off the transformer. Mostly 120V circuits wired off one or the other bus. Both busses used for 240V.

Commercial often uses 208V 3-phase however, mostly for heavy duty electric motors as more efficient and less wearing.

Note that our Ground/Earth wires are often left off such schematics for simplicity. Each circuit is also grounded for "path of least resistance" safety.

How do you guys get 240V? Is that the phase difference between two phases? Or is it a separate wire from the main transformer?

 

[JimmyVW]

As I said, Single phase in USA homes (multi-phase distribution but then only single phase to each home). We get two conductors off the transformer. Mostly 120V circuits wired off one or the other bus. Both busses used for 240V.

Commercial often uses 3-phase however, mostly for heavy duty electric motors as more efficient and less wearing.

View attachment 3854

ah yes, very nice drawing. you guys get 2*120v and between the two 120v phases it’s 240v.
Only thing I’m missing are the main fuses before the main breaker. I’d expect some fuses there to protect against shorts between hot 1 and hot 2 or hot and ground

 

[Huey52]

Yes, there is an overarching max-capacity breaker pair on the entry hot leads too, actually shown at top of the schematic as "Main Breaker."

Our latest code (NEC) calls for a discrete meter-panel on the building exterior, towards the front-side, containing this master disconnect, in addition to the main panel often within the structure. This is for ease/assurity of first responder safety. Kind of a pain for the homeowner to have to go outside to completely kill the power. But then I also have to disable my generator in proximity.

btw: We've moved away from "fuses" (although fuses are just as electrically capable as breakers in most cases, exception being GFCI, etc. capabilities now built-into breakers).

ah yes, very nice drawing. you guys get 2*120v and between the two 120v phases it’s 240v.
Only thing I’m missing are the main fuses before the main breaker. I’d expect some fuses there to protect against shorts between hot 1 and hot 2 or hot and ground

 

[JimmyVW]

Same here, we switched to breakers too, though I still have the old fashioned porcelain main fuses

 

[JimMacNair]

I have been watching the ElectrifyHome web page. Their home charger seems to have been on back order for a couple of months. Does anyone else know what is going on? Also, they show a 50 amp plug. I believe it can also be hard wired. Since my breaker panel is in my garage right next to where I will park my car the run is very short. I was planning on hard wire but is there any advantage to hard wire over a 50 amp plug? My interest in this topic is picking up as my dealer gave me a date of 7/30 for build complete for my AWD model that I ordered in January. I would like to get the charger in advance, so I can figure out how I want to install it. I would like to stick to the recommended charger but may have to buy something different.

 

[JimMacNair]

I have been snooping around the web, looking at alternatives. I am now in a high state of panic. Every charger that I look at is back ordered. Chargepoint says it is backordered but will ship in 4-5 weeks. My car could conceivable arrive in that timeframe. Yikes!

 

[Enzo589]

I have been snooping around the web, looking at alternatives. I am now in a high state of panic. Every charger that I look at is back ordered. Chargepoint says it is backordered but will ship in 4-5 weeks. My car could conceivable arrive in that timeframe. Yikes!

I just ordered a Grizzl-e Classic from Amazon. I got their Avalanche Edition, which should arrive to me by middle of August, but if you need something ahead of receiving your car, they have their Camo version (they're just different colors, but all have the same functionality), you can get it in a few days. The nice thing about the Grizzl-e is the amperage can be adjusted based on what your wiring is/will be.