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WRT eTron: $55K before TC makes for a very compelling deal. For a extra $10K over the price of an undiscounted ID.4 FE, one gets ALL of the "wanna haves" people are talking about here on this forum: including heat pump, surround view, HUD, AWD, one size larger and the Audi label with the super luxury interiors that Audi is justly famous for. The disadvantage of a car that is in it's second year of production is largely offset by the price. Plus, the ID.4 FE is likely to see at least as large a 3-yr depreciation as the eTron because both will have the same range when EV's in 3 years will be marketing much longer ranges. I'll have a long look at eTron deals at the time the AWD Pro shows up and if I can score a similar deal, it will be hard to pass up. Particularly as the Q4 eTron is unlikely to be seeing any discounts on introduction.
 

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There is also one more thing to consider: software stability. Most, if not all, strange quirks should be out of Audi systems by now. ID.4 will be still in pretty much public beta for a while.
Another thing that is pretty nice to have is a flat 150kW charging curve in Audi. I do not believe ID.4 will have it similar.
 

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I'm closer and closer to moving with eTron. I can get the premium plus unit loaded with good discounts that bring it close to 55k before tax incentives. It's a bigger car with plenty of space and I do like the way it runs. The three days i had it on a loan i got 250 mile range out of it with really little effort. All it takes is not sprinting from stop and just taking care to coast. Given the equipment level i think it's close to no brainier honestly. Plenty of eTron stock to move and dealers are motivated to move them.
Wow! Would you mind sharing your rough location? Was this a 2021 model? I really like the e-tron as well, but the best I’ve been able to negotiate was 63k for a premium trim with the convenience package which is a little too rich for my blood. I would totally jump on a premium plus at 55k if I could find one for that.

I have a FE reservation on the ID4 since September, but the lack of the heat pump and 360 camera might be deal breakers for me. I’m hanging onto my reservation for the time being just to keep my options open.
 

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There is also one more thing to consider: software stability. Most, if not all, strange quirks should be out of Audi systems by now. ID.4 will be still in pretty much public beta for a while.
Another thing that is pretty nice to have is a flat 150kW charging curve in Audi. I do not believe ID.4 will have it similar.
How would you know that ID.4 will not have a flat curve (although 125kw max)?
 

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Dusk Blue ID.4 FE, 2X - 2004 Phaeton V8
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Not to turn this into ebay motors, but for anyone who is interested:

Off Lease Only Used 2019 Audi e-tron Prestige Quattro for sale in Florida

This one was $89K new and now asking $55k with 20k miles and has the Edition One package, and looks like it has everything else. I have bought from these folks before and it is a very straightforward process. The price stated is the price and there is no haggling and they will ship. When I bought a MKZ hybrid there a few years ago the finance guy told me that on an average month they move 1200 cars thru Orlando alone.
 

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Not to turn this into ebay motors, but for anyone who is interested:

Off Lease Only Used 2019 Audi e-tron Prestige Quattro for sale in Florida

This one was $89K new and now asking $55k with 20k miles and has the Edition One package, and looks like it has everything else. I have bought from these folks before and it is a very straightforward process. The price stated is the price and there is no haggling and they will ship. When I bought a MKZ hybrid there a few years ago the finance guy told me that on an average month they move 1200 cars thru Orlando alone.
It’s unclear if @mmmzon is talking about a new or used e-tron. $55k for a used e-tron doesn’t seem all that special, plenty low-mileage models listed for sale at or below that price on autotrader. $55k for a new one is a screaming deal, however, especially when you consider that’s before the $7500 federal tax credit.
 

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That was a new one medium trim. However it seems like the dealership I was working with is now backpedaling on the price to the tune of more than 12k, making the previous 55k cost now close to 67k. Still new and still appetizing but lesson learned here is to get the damn things on paper. It would come at 58k after all tax incentives, which bring sit 18k more than ID.4 I reserved. With that much of a gap it is substantially less of a attractive offer.
 

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How would you know that ID.4 will not have a flat curve (although 125kw max)?
If ID.3 is any indication, it will not unless they dramatically changed their battery design. I think that would invalidate the whole platform modularity.



Compare it to eTron. I am not trying to dissuade anybody, just stating the obvious (I think). eTron has a different thermal battery management. This will help in longer trips for sure.

 

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Happy owner of a blue ID.4 FE
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I doubt Audi knows more about battery chemistry or about its thermal management than VW or Tesla do. That flat charging curve to me represents warranty audacity more than anything else. With those currents up to 80% more unwanted chemical reactions will happen and degrade the battery.
 

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I only see the Audi graph.
 

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If you look at the study of battery degradation by manufacturer, on average team VW does better, less degradation, than Tesla based on real world data.
 

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ID.4 Pro S AWD / Waiting, waiting, waiting
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I don't have a link saved, I think it was posted somewhere on this forum, or InsideEV's site.
EDIT: found it, it was actually in this thread.
Thank you for this. Here is a link of just the comparison table in a larger size:


It would be nice to be able to adjust the Y axis. No need for it to go to zero.

However, I am not sure the data shows any significant advantage of one vs another manufacturer (with the exception of older Leafs). The study is a good start but needs more data and longer period. It's hard comparing a a vehicle with 100-125 range vs one with 300+ mile range as the longer range vehicles will have more Level 3 charging (which clearly affects degradation more than any other variable). I would also be more interested seeing the chart by miles driven instead of age as charge cycles affect degradation much more than time.
 

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If ID.3 is any indication, it will not unless they dramatically changed their battery design. I think that would invalidate the whole platform modularity.



Compare it to eTron. I am not trying to dissuade anybody, just stating the obvious (I think). eTron has a different thermal battery management. This will help in longer trips for sure.

also Id3 is soft locked at 100kwh
 

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I'm closer and closer to moving with eTron. I can get the premium plus unit loaded with good discounts that bring it close to 55k before tax incentives. It's a bigger car with plenty of space and I do like the way it runs. The three days i had it on a loan i got 250 mile range out of it with really little effort. All it takes is not sprinting from stop and just taking care to coast. Given the equipment level i think it's close to no brainier honestly. Plenty of eTron stock to move and dealers are motivated to move them.
wTron for $55K? That's an absolute no brainer in my opinion. Does that include all of the driver's assist features? Even with lower range than many other EVs, it makes a good car for long trips because it charges more quickly than anything else currently available. Maybe I should go visit my Audi dealer.
 

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The best premium plus deals for an eTron in Houston are currently in the $65K area and only 2021's are available, now. Last Dec, 2019 Models were uniformly getting $13-$17K discounts. I'd suggest that anyone waiting for an up-spec AWD ID.4 should cross-shop the eTron about the time the AWD models show up.
 

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ID.4 Pro S AWD / Waiting, waiting, waiting
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Small sample size, but here is my 1 time charging my 3 at a Tesla 250 kW charger:

TimeBattery LevelBattery RangeKwH AddedCharge Rate
09/18/20 18:221852.8200
09/18/20 18:232368.493.67917.1
09/18/20 18:242882.817.02836.9
09/18/20 18:253296.249.95788
09/18/20 18:2636108.7813.09755.9
09/18/20 18:2740119.5215.61724.3
09/18/20 18:2844131.1618.33683.4
09/18/20 18:2947141.920.84639.9
09/18/20 18:3051151.7523.15593.3
09/18/20 18:3153160.725.24551.7
09/18/20 18:3257170.127.44512.4
09/18/20 18:3359178.1629.33477.7
09/18/20 18:3462186.2231.21443.4
09/18/20 18:3564193.3832.89415.1
09/18/20 18:3666200.5434.57389.8
09/18/20 18:3768205.9135.82366.8
09/18/20 18:3870211.7337.19348.6
09/18/20 18:3972217.1138.44319.9
09/18/20 18:4074222.9239.8296.7
09/18/20 18:4176227.440.85277.1
09/18/20 18:4277231.8841.9256.6
09/18/20 18:4378236.3542.95239.5
09/18/20 18:4480240.3843.89231

22 minutes from 18%-80% adding 188 miles of range. I didn't start at 10% but assuming would match the E-Tron 10-80% 25 minute charge time. Not sure how much a couple minutes more or less affects an entire trip - 22 minutes does rush you if you need a bathroom break and want to pick up some food/refreshments.

Having said that, if I can find a new E-Tron for $55k, I'd be third in line behind @mmmzon and @FredT .
 

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VW ID.4 1st Max | Mangan Gray
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If ID.3 is any indication, it will not unless they dramatically changed their battery design. I think that would invalidate the whole platform modularity.

The "ProS" line is the ID.3 77 kWH variant aka ID.4 77kWh.

I can Vouch for this charging curve. This is what i saw with a warm and empty battery. [atleast till 45% it is spot on]
 
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