[Eric Nay]

I love my ID.4 (required foundation setting) BUT there are problems that I think are worth talking about. Discussion of those points are NOT saying the baby should be thrown out along with the bathwater, BUT they are "Chances to succeed".

1) Lack of communication from VWoA.
2) Lack of clarity on build delays and lack of FIFO queueing.
3) Lack of rollout of software updates to fix known bugs.
4) Lack of scheduled charging (Critical to those on ToU power plans).
5) Charging issues (both hot and cold) causing slow charging.
6) Lack of trained Technicians at dealerships.

I think complaining about any of these are fair game.

 

[Don]

I don't know much of anything about how VW has programmed the car with regards to protecting the battery during fast charging, but it would not surprise me at all if there are various protections built in that we owners know little, if anything about

Like many others, my experience with EA charging is almost always during road trips and is pretty much as VW advertises it. If I begin with 10% or there abouts and if I've been driving the car for an hour or more, then it almost always starts at around 120 to 125Kw and begins it's normal tapering routine. The OP says he understand that it begins to taper at 80%, but in actuality, it begins tapering much earlier than that. My car is always tapered down to 100Kw or a bit less by the time it gets to 50% and it tapers a couple more times before I get to 80%. I've not yet ever needed to fast charge beyond 80%, but I would assume it really tapers off after that

They advertise 5% to 80% in 38 minutes (75% of 77 Kw, which is 58 Kw) and if it did a full 125 Kw for that entire time, then it would take about 27 minutes minutes to put 58 Kw back into the battery, so a gradual tapering takes place all along the charge cycle. All this is under 'ideal' conditions it goes without saying . . . . I guess

I've read that VW bases their battery warranty on 20% DCFC charging and 80% L1 or L2 charging. DC fast charging is hard on the battery so if they don't want to go bankrupt from warranty claims from those who use it exclusively, then it makes sense (at least to me) that there would probably be other 'protections' built into fast charging which ensure that the battery will live up to it's expected life span no matter how badly some owners are treating it - Repeated fast charging under other than ideal conditions get slowed down, sometimes markedly so, and the car (and VW) considers that 'normal', or 'as expected'

All the above is 100% conjecture on my part, because I'm not nearly smart enough to know for sure what's going on. Myself, I kinda wish there was an option for users to adjust DCFC rates down when time isn't of the essence, to help ensure a longer battery life. There are people getting 400 to 500 thousand miles from an EV battery and I'd like to be one of those. I'd be happy with a 75 Kw starting rate much of the time - Another 15 or 20 minutes often isn't a big deal for me, assuming the EA station isn't crowded, which I've yet to experience even once

 

[JimmyVW]

the 3.1 update will give you a new charging curve, keeping the 125KW+ (upto 135KW) range way longer in the charge.
with 3.1 you'll charge from 5% to 80% in 29 minutes.

 

[vwid4epiphany]

Took delivery of my ID.4 in May of 2021. Depsite the various bugs with the car, I have enjoyed it EXCEPT for one problem -- charging speeds at
Electrify America Stations. I've been told that the 2021 ID.4 can accept charging speeds of 125kW and 135kW for the 2022 ID.4. Most EA
stations have a claimed output ability of 150kW or 350kW, usually some units with each speed at most locations.

I am familiar that the rate of charge can be dependent on many factors, including environment conditions, the battery level at the time of the
charge, etc. I realize that the charging speed slows down when the battery gets to 80%.

At most EA stations I've visited, I get charging speeds of 50 to 60Kw, even when I'm starting with a battery at 20% or so. I'm extremely lucky
when I get 80Kw, and a couple of times I even reached 100Kw. For the longest time, I felt the problem was with EA and their inferior equipment.
Early on EA reps would tell me it's a problem with my ID.4. I've taken my car into the dealership three times to have this issue check out and
all three times I was told my car is working perfectly, as designed. During my most recent visit, I spoke with the dealership's GM, who drives an ID.4. He
said the Number One complaint they hear about the ID.4 is the slow charging at EA stations. He told me they have reached out to VW, but
they don't seem to listen or care.

As more electric vehicles hit the roads, I have met many owner's of other electric vehicles, charging at EA stations. These include many Rivians,
BMW's, Porsche's, and Fords. In all of these cases, these vehicle owners were getting charging speeds that were double or triple what I have
been getting. This past Sunday in Utah, I went into an EA station iwth about 20% left on my battery and got a charging speed of 85kW tops.
A few minutes later, a Porsche Taycan pulled in to charge next to me. He started with a battery level of 24% and was getting a charging
speed of 195kW. At another station, a Rivian pick-up was getting a charging speed of 148kW, compared to my 64kW.

This morning I called VW Customer Care to ascertain how I can get my issue escalated and have someone higher up the food chain run
diagnostics or determine why I'm getting nowhere near the advertised 125kW speed ability VW has in their advertising. I was shut down.
Told that since a dealer found no problem, there was NOTHING they can do to assist me. It was clear they simply don't care.

Before I took delivery of my car, I received emails and phone calls from VW, with people willing to answer questions and otherwise
help, since I was getting one of the early deliveries. Those people have probably been redeployed.to answer complaint calls.

I'm posting this for two reasons......
1. I'm curious what charging speeds other ID.4 owners are experiencing at EA stations (I charge primarily in Utah, Nevada and California).

2, I want prospective ID.4 owners to know that this may be an issue when you get your car, if you are depending on EA charging
stations.

Thanks!

same experience, only a few minutes >100kwh, mostly ~50 in EA, I feel nothing wrong with the car, it's more related with software control. But be honest, is it really good for battery under such high power input?

 

[hilld]

Or my favorite:

MY VW ID.4 BLEW UP AND KILLED ME

Don't forget, my ID.4 (I ordered) caught on fire and sank the Felicity Ace along with 4000 other cars.

 

[Huey52]

Ok, good point in that the creators have done what they feel they must do to entice we ever more limited attention span viewers. But again YT has in a way forced this behavior given the way they calculate their many variables and subsequently caused creators to react.
My insight is based on a couple personally known woodworking content providers (a relatively benign subject matter environment btw, except perhaps when it comes to pocket hole joinery vs. more traditional types 🤪) who are very open in detailing how they make a living from same. They blame this computational "sensationalism" trend. Most don't like the "quick shots" either, but as YT created and essentially forced upon them ... (yes, again root cause we collectively attention span challenged).

Ok, now back to sensationalist "VWoA not caring."

Off topic but I think you guys are misinterpreting YouTube's algorithm. YT continues to promote videos with the highest numbers of clicks / watch time / shares. The creators have figured out what titles and what thumbnails get the most views. Ultimately the creators are putting up what resonates with the broadest audience. It's "our" fault (collectively).

 

[KB57]

Took delivery of my ID.4 in May of 2021. Depsite the various bugs with the car, I have enjoyed it EXCEPT for one problem -- charging speeds at
Electrify America Stations. I've been told that the 2021 ID.4 can accept charging speeds of 125kW and 135kW for the 2022 ID.4. Most EA
stations have a claimed output ability of 150kW or 350kW, usually some units with each speed at most locations.

I am familiar that the rate of charge can be dependent on many factors, including environment conditions, the battery level at the time of the
charge, etc. I realize that the charging speed slows down when the battery gets to 80%.

At most EA stations I've visited, I get charging speeds of 50 to 60Kw, even when I'm starting with a battery at 20% or so. I'm extremely lucky
when I get 80Kw, and a couple of times I even reached 100Kw. For the longest time, I felt the problem was with EA and their inferior equipment.
Early on EA reps would tell me it's a problem with my ID.4. I've taken my car into the dealership three times to have this issue check out and
all three times I was told my car is working perfectly, as designed. During my most recent visit, I spoke with the dealership's GM, who drives an ID.4. He
said the Number One complaint they hear about the ID.4 is the slow charging at EA stations. He told me they have reached out to VW, but
they don't seem to listen or care.

As more electric vehicles hit the roads, I have met many owner's of other electric vehicles, charging at EA stations. These include many Rivians,
BMW's, Porsche's, and Fords. In all of these cases, these vehicle owners were getting charging speeds that were double or triple what I have
been getting. This past Sunday in Utah, I went into an EA station iwth about 20% left on my battery and got a charging speed of 85kW tops.
A few minutes later, a Porsche Taycan pulled in to charge next to me. He started with a battery level of 24% and was getting a charging
speed of 195kW. At another station, a Rivian pick-up was getting a charging speed of 148kW, compared to my 64kW.

This morning I called VW Customer Care to ascertain how I can get my issue escalated and have someone higher up the food chain run
diagnostics or determine why I'm getting nowhere near the advertised 125kW speed ability VW has in their advertising. I was shut down.
Told that since a dealer found no problem, there was NOTHING they can do to assist me. It was clear they simply don't care.

Before I took delivery of my car, I received emails and phone calls from VW, with people willing to answer questions and otherwise
help, since I was getting one of the early deliveries. Those people have probably been redeployed.to answer complaint calls.

I'm posting this for two reasons......
1. I'm curious what charging speeds other ID.4 owners are experiencing at EA stations (I charge primarily in Utah, Nevada and California).

2, I want prospective ID.4 owners to know that this may be an issue when you get your car, if you are depending on EA charging
stations.

Thanks!

We live in south east Arizona, if the EA stations are even running I have never gotten over 85kwh. I have talk with VW and it’s not the programming in the car. It is on EA end. At first EA seemed to be concerned and would reset their station to try to achieve a higher rate of charge. It never helped. They would look at the station status and tell us which station was charging the fastest. Going to Vegas there is a station in Kingman. They have had two stations down a long time now. This is a popular spott for all Eva to charge since it’s the only station between Vegas and phoenix. with the two stations down there is always a wait for a charger. i just charged there and at 28% of battery was receiving a charge rate of 84kwh. Tesla is suppose to open their stations to all evs later this year. Maybe their stations will achieve the 125kwh that the ID can handle. I can take the slower speed that EA puts into the car. I am retired and have the time, but what is frustrating is having the broken down stations from months on end.

 

[Eric Nay]

it’s not the programming in the car. It is on EA end.

I still think it is VW's fault, in that they don't handle hot charging situations properly. I've seen Hyundais next to us getting over 100kW when we are getting 43kW. And that is after trying all the tricks such as trying different chargers and calling EA.

I think they did insufficient testing in the southwest during summer. MAYBE they can improve it with software, like the cold charging is supposed to get with 3.x software. Maybe...

 

[Plant Peon]

I still think it is VW's fault, in that they don't handle hot charging situations properly. I've seen Hyundais next to us getting over 100kW when we are getting 43kW. And that is after trying all the tricks such as trying different chargers and calling EA.

I think they did insufficient testing in the southwest during summer. MAYBE they can improve it with software, like the cold charging is supposed to get with 3.x software. Maybe...

Link
Search the web for this. You might find it interesting. 😉

 

[newb2]

Took delivery of my ID.4 in May of 2021. Depsite the various bugs with the car, I have enjoyed it EXCEPT for one problem -- charging speeds at
Electrify America Stations. I've been told that the 2021 ID.4 can accept charging speeds of 125kW and 135kW for the 2022 ID.4. Most EA
stations have a claimed output ability of 150kW or 350kW, usually some units with each speed at most locations.

I am familiar that the rate of charge can be dependent on many factors, including environment conditions, the battery level at the time of the
charge, etc. I realize that the charging speed slows down when the battery gets to 80%.

At most EA stations I've visited, I get charging speeds of 50 to 60Kw, even when I'm starting with a battery at 20% or so. I'm extremely lucky
when I get 80Kw, and a couple of times I even reached 100Kw. For the longest time, I felt the problem was with EA and their inferior equipment.
Early on EA reps would tell me it's a problem with my ID.4. I've taken my car into the dealership three times to have this issue check out and
all three times I was told my car is working perfectly, as designed. During my most recent visit, I spoke with the dealership's GM, who drives an ID.4. He
said the Number One complaint they hear about the ID.4 is the slow charging at EA stations. He told me they have reached out to VW, but
they don't seem to listen or care.

As more electric vehicles hit the roads, I have met many owner's of other electric vehicles, charging at EA stations. These include many Rivians,
BMW's, Porsche's, and Fords. In all of these cases, these vehicle owners were getting charging speeds that were double or triple what I have
been getting. This past Sunday in Utah, I went into an EA station iwth about 20% left on my battery and got a charging speed of 85kW tops.
A few minutes later, a Porsche Taycan pulled in to charge next to me. He started with a battery level of 24% and was getting a charging
speed of 195kW. At another station, a Rivian pick-up was getting a charging speed of 148kW, compared to my 64kW.

This morning I called VW Customer Care to ascertain how I can get my issue escalated and have someone higher up the food chain run
diagnostics or determine why I'm getting nowhere near the advertised 125kW speed ability VW has in their advertising. I was shut down.
Told that since a dealer found no problem, there was NOTHING they can do to assist me. It was clear they simply don't care.

Before I took delivery of my car, I received emails and phone calls from VW, with people willing to answer questions and otherwise
help, since I was getting one of the early deliveries. Those people have probably been redeployed.to answer complaint calls.

I'm posting this for two reasons......
1. I'm curious what charging speeds other ID.4 owners are experiencing at EA stations (I charge primarily in Utah, Nevada and California).

2, I want prospective ID.4 owners to know that this may be an issue when you get your car, if you are depending on EA charging
stations.

Thanks!

In Arizona at Electrify America stations I am getting anywhere between 30 and 43 kWh. Never more. But the weather is at the 105F level.
Most of the time EA station cut out charging within 10 minutes, and have to restart. Sometimes they cut within 3 minutes.
I complained to EA, and a week later the same stations were equally slow and unreliable. The were so to my VW and to Rivian and Niro that tried at the same time. Complaining again. We'll see in two weeks.

 

[ga2500ev]

In Arizona at Electrify America stations I am getting anywhere between 30 and 43 kWh. Never more. But the weather is at the 105F level.
Most of the time EA station cut out charging within 10 minutes, and have to restart. Sometimes they cut within 3 minutes.
I complained to EA, and a week later the same stations were equally slow and unreliable. The were so to my VW and to Rivian and Niro that tried at the same time. Complaining again. We'll see in two weeks.

That is unfortunate. I automatically switch dispensers if I'm below 25% SOC and it doesn't ramp up above 80 kW within a minute of connecting in decent weather.

Just personally I've found the 150 kW EA units to be more reliable to crank up than the 350 kW units. So, I generally target the 150 kW unit that doesn't have the Chademo connector as my first try. It's been working pretty reliably at many different stations here in the Southeast for me in the last few months.

ga2500ev

 

[Jenovalente]

That is unfortunate. I automatically switch dispensers if I'm below 25% SOC and it doesn't ramp up above 80 kW within a minute of connecting in decent weather.

Just personally I've found the 150 kW EA units to be more reliable to crank up than the 350 kW units. So, I generally target the 150 kW unit that doesn't have the Chademo connector as my first try. It's been working pretty reliably at many different stations here in the Southeast for me in the last few months.

ga2500ev

Hi;
I recently joined this forum as I reserved an ID4 as a backup to a Subaru Solterra.
you may have seen that the Toyota version of the car was recalled (the entire manufacturing lot) due to the wheels literally falling off the car.
The charging curve for the Solterra/bz4x is abysmal and tests show it charges like a slug, most likely due to Toyota’s (who manufactures the car for itself and Subaru) conservative approach and reluctance to fit reputational risk if the batteries fail - although the fact that the wheels fall off brand new cars does not help their reputation. I believe Toyota recommends not more than one DCFC session a day, which makes road-trips difficult as the AWD version is rated for 220mi. AWD and FWD also use different size battery backs and manufacturers.

 

[Eric Nay]

I haven't checked prices lately, but with those problems on the Solterra, I can't see them selling more than a handful unless they are less than $20,000.

 

[Manybees]

I haven't checked prices lately, but with those problems on the Solterra, I can't see them selling more than a handful unless they are less than $20,000.

A “handful” is all they’ve allocated to the U.S. market, so it won’t be possible to sell more than that anyway.

 

[B&K]

We have a 2021 VW ID-4 purchased in August 2021, and an Electrify America home charger, on a 220, with 50 amp circuit breaker. Unfortunately we cannot use the "max" power setting when charging the car, it ALWAYS trips the circuit breaker, even when set to use the somewhat lower 32amp setting. Our electrician can't find any reason our home wiring shouldn't work fine, so it must be either a problem with the Electrify America charging unit (which they replaced once at no charge), or the VW ID-4. Of course, VW says it must be either the EA charger or the home wiring. Meanwhile, we have to use the "reduced power" setting to charge the car at home, which takes 10-12 hours per charge at minimum, at the very slow rate of about 2 kw per hour. Other electronic problems persist with our VW ID-4: Persistent "child safety lock fault" notifications (supposedly fixed early on with a software update, but obviously never fixed...our early-adolescent grandkids can't get out of the car from the back seat, and I have to actually get out of the car and use the key remote to unlock the doors, and sometimes that doesn't even work; the "infotainment system" is spotty at best, sometimes the bluetooth function doesn't function; the "album covers" feature gets stuck on one image, irrespective of which song is playing; the volume fluctuates for unknown reasons; etc.
Also re: the "infotainment" system - a major design complaint: Rotating positive-click knobs to adjust sound volume, fan blower level, etc. are easier and safer to manage while driving than the touch-screen-only which demands the driver remove eyes from the road to look at the screen. Is there some reason we can't have those easy-to-find-by-touch control knobs in an electric car? Geez! I guess these designers never actually drive the cars...

 

[Nycturne]

We have a 2021 VW ID-4 purchased in August 2021, and an Electrify America home charger, on a 220, with 50 amp circuit breaker. Unfortunately we cannot use the "max" power setting when charging the car, it ALWAYS trips the circuit breaker, even when set to use the somewhat lower 32amp setting. Our electrician can't find any reason our home wiring shouldn't work fine, so it must be either a problem with the Electrify America charging unit (which they replaced once at no charge), or the VW ID-4.

This sounds a lot like GFCI nusinance tripping, not tripping from current. This is not uncommon when an EVSE with built-in GFCI is paired with a GFCI breaker. The Electrify America manual for the home EVSE states:

Do not install this charger on a GFCI circuit breaker.

So something I’d check is to see if the electrician put a GFCI breaker in. I’m not suggesting the electrician did shoddy work here, as it is expected to use GFCI (or better) breakers in all but very specific situations in the US. The manual doesn’t do a great job calling this out, and if the electrician doesn’t install many EVSEs, it could very well be overlooked on accident.

——

Also re: the "infotainment" system - a major design complaint: Rotating positive-click knobs to adjust sound volume, fan blower level, etc. are easier and safer to manage while driving than the touch-screen-only which demands the driver remove eyes from the road to look at the screen. Is there some reason we can't have those easy-to-find-by-touch control knobs in an electric car? Geez! I guess these designers never actually drive the cars...

On this side, I wouldn’t be surprised if the designers/engineers fight the bean counters on this. Mechanical parts can add up quick in costs, compared to touch controllers. At low volume, a single toggle switch is a couple bucks. A capacitive touch controller with 16 channels is about the same price. So I could easily wire up a whole touch-sensitive steering wheel for the cost of a couple physical buttons.

It’s a bit depressing, to be honest.

 

[Nai3t]

the "max" power setting when charging the car, it ALWAYS trips the circuit breaker, even when set to use the somewhat lower 32amp setting.
...
it must be either a problem with the Electrify America charging unit (which they replaced once at no charge), or the VW ID-4.

Install a new circuit breaker if you haven't done so already. This is low cost — under $20 – and a top candidate for the culprit of your troubles.

 

[B&K]

This sounds a lot like GFCI nusinance tripping, not tripping from current. This is not uncommon when an EVSE with built-in GFCI is paired with a GFCI breaker. The Electrify America manual for the home EVSE states:



So something I’d check is to see if the electrician put a GFCI breaker in. I’m not suggesting the electrician did shoddy work here, as it is expected to use GFCI (or better) breakers in all but very specific situations in the US. The manual doesn’t do a great job calling this out, and if the electrician doesn’t install many EVSEs, it could very well be overlooked on accident.

——


On this side, I wouldn’t be surprised if the designers/engineers fight the bean counters on this. Mechanical parts can add up quick in costs, compared to touch controllers. At low volume, a single toggle switch is a couple bucks. A capacitive touch controller with 16 channels is about the same price. So I could easily wire up a whole touch-sensitive steering wheel for the cost of a couple physical buttons.

It’s a bit depressing, to be honest.

Thanks for your feedback. The circuit breaker is not a GFCI breaker, we did check that.
Interesting notes on the mechanical switches vs. touch switches! I'd be happy to pay another couple bucks for the old style knobs I can easily control without taking my eyes off the road!

 

[B&K]

Install a new circuit breaker if you haven't done so already. This is low cost — under $20 – and a top candidate for the culprit of your troubles.

Yup, we've done that! Didn't help.

 

[Nai3t]

a major design complaint: Rotating positive-click knobs to adjust sound volume, fan blower level, etc. are easier and safer to manage while driving than the touch-screen-only which demands the driver remove eyes from the road to look at the screen. Is there some reason we can't have those easy-to-find-by-touch control knobs in an electric car? Geez! I guess these designers never actually drive the cars...

Everything you mentioned deserves its own thread, not lumped into a general "problems" thread. It's certainly a worthy discussion what types of controls you prefer, but it is functioning as intended, ie. not a "problem" as in not working as intended. So I'm not dismissing your critique, but it's what you signed up for when you bought it.

FWIW I agree, more hard controls are my preference, too, but I gave the VW touch controls a good workout during my test drive (and shared my concern/thoughts with my wife, who is the primary driver) and we decided we could get along with this setup. So no regrets – is what it is and works as intended – but up to me, I'd do it differently.