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EV Preference?

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These are both platform cars so it's really MEB vs. E-GMP as far as I'm concerned. The "chrome" on top of the platform depends on what creature features you want. If you want it all you should really go for Audi's MEB builds instead of VW's. As far as the platform is concerned - I don't know that much about E-GMP's internals and especially the battery pack. I was horrified to learn that the Mach-E's pack has a multitude of internal plumbing connections which is just a disaster waiting to happen. The MEB pack of the ID.4, by contrast, is built like a tank and looks to be very serviceable and very reliable (e.g. only one external plumbing connection, etc.) Also, I think 800V needs to be battle-tested. I'm not convinced yet that 800V fast charging is not going to come at a cost of safety/longevity compared to 400V.

 

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At least with the pricing as of now, Ioniq 5 and EV6 (and Q4 e-tron) seem to be starting around the point where ID.4 ends, so I'm not sure the overlap is all that great, especially since the base models of the $45k tier cars don't have all the content of the Pro S and the differentiating EV6 model features like the HUD and blind-spot camera are options—and I'm not sure the U.S. EV6 even offers ventilated seats; the EV6 page describes the first edition seats as just being "heated."

So I voted ID.4, even though if I had another $5-10k to burn the Ioniq 5/EV 6/Q4/XC40/Polestar 2 debate might be more compelling.
 

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Discussion Starter · #23 ·
Thank you everyone for voting and posting your perspectives!
 

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I also voted ID.4.

The ID.4 near term seems to be the best bang for your buck EV. It isn’t the best at anyone thing but it is good at a lot. It really is the most practical (besides the Q4), square trunk space, roof rails, somewhat normal door handles and real ground clearance.

The official specs of the Ioniq 5 for the US have been posted. The SEL which seems to be inline with the Pro S has some missing features compared to the ID.4. Most people think there Ioniq 5 equivalent will be $3-5k more. The AWD version will come with a heat pump but I worry about those door handles freezing in the winter and no wiper on the rear window is also concerning. I do think it will be a good EV kinda wished it wasn’t as tall (same height as ID.4 with 2.2 inches of less ground clearance) and didn't have a really long wheelbase.

With the EV6 we know the FE is $58,500 which seems steep for a Kia. I have the same general thoughts on the EV6 as Ioniq 5. I do prefer the Ioniq 5.

The Q4 interests me a lot since hopefully some of the missing features on the ID.4 will show-up on the US bound Q4. For example heated rear seats, heat pump and adapter suspension. Worry that the model I would want would be close to $60k.

One other EV in this price range is the Polestar 2 (2022 models). Not an CUV or SUV but has similar ground clearance to the Ioniq 5 and more upright seating position do to it being a shorter car. I was surprised how big the trunk was. It’s biggest faults are no real good front passenger storage and price seems to high for a vehicle made in China.
 

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One other EV in this price range is the Polestar 2 (2022 models). Not an CUV or SUV but has similar ground clearance to the Ioniq 5 and more upright seating position do to it being a shorter car. I was surprised how big the trunk was. It’s biggest faults are no real good front passenger storage and price seems to high for a vehicle made in China.
The Polestar definitely has its shortcomings, but being made in China isn't one.

The car my ID.4 replaced was a Chinese-built Volvo S60 Inscription, and it was easily one of the most solidly built, reliable cars I've owned.

Geely by all accounts has embraced Volvo's assembly techniques, and when my wife and I drove the Polestar 2, it was evidently of the same lineage.

There is no way to convincingly make a blanket statement that a Chinese-built anything is of any less value than the a similar item built elsewhere. It has to be based on the merits the actual product being evaluated.
 

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I think price/offering the VW is a better deal than the Kia.

Also if you have the extra $15k wouldn't a top-tier Ford Mach-e be a better option than the Kia?
The Mach-E GT performance edition ($70+K) that still can't even beat the non-performance Model Y in the 1/4 mile? I think the Mach-E is severely limited by 400V and the batteries they use.

Porsche and Kia/Hyundai using 800V for performance models is the future.
 

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The Polestar definitely has its shortcomings, but being made in China isn't one.

The car my ID.4 replaced was a Chinese-built Volvo S60 Inscription, and it was easily one of the most solidly built, reliable cars I've owned.

Geely by all accounts has embraced Volvo's assembly techniques, and when my wife and I drove the Polestar 2, it was evidently of the same lineage.

There is no way to convincingly make a blanket statement that a Chinese-built anything is of any less value than the a similar item built elsewhere. It has to be based on the merits the actual product being evaluated.
I am not saying it is poorly built. I did test drive the car for 2 hours last month and all of what you touched was high quality (vent knobs and volume knob for example). Just saying that the labor and most likely materials costs are less than in Europe and the US. I know that part of the higher costs are high tariffs just wished it was $5-10K less like the Volvo XC40/C40. Having the less fancy versions in both FWD and AWD has kept me interested. It really is the right size vehicle for me. Hopefully they have enough success globally with this generation P*2 that they will make a next generation that fixes it biggest fault which is lack of passenger storage. One cool feature it does have is the folding out trailer hitch that you see in European cars but not in cars sold in the US.
 

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For this purchase it's the ID.4 and it's price point that win for me, this will be a car my kids (college students) use to get around and replacing a lower range Fiat 500E.

My list of cars i want to use as a daily driver is much longer and much more expensive :D
 

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My trepidation about 800V architecture appears to not be without merit. Kyle Conner is over in Germany right now and just tested fast charging an EV6 (E-GMP platform). Insane early charging rates but disappointing later (likely thermal related). This tech needs to be baked more IMHO but is certainly impressive. A charging beast.

 

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And the Hyundai Ioniq 5 got delayed from "Fall 2021" to "Winter 2021" for the US Market...
 

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"And Others"...

I would like to add (for consideration) the vehicle we settled on. We took delivery on Aug 31.

https://www.volvocars.com/us/v/cars/xc40-electric

No one is talking about this car. That is a shame. I will give details on real world performance in weeks to come.
We were able to lease this car under MSRP (total amount under MSRP = 10K apx including 7500.) incentive.

Lots of issues with the ID.4 forced us to look further.
Very happy with the Volvo (was NEVER a fan of the brand).
I would love to consider an XC40-$10k more than id.4-40 miles less range
 

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If you think that the Ionic 5 will be available for purchase in the U.S. during 2021, I have some land in AZ that i want to sell you.
I'm actually on the Ioniq 5 pre-order list (which I will cancel since I've decided to go ahead with my ID.4 AWD Pro S) and got an email from Hyundai USA yesterday about local events to check out the Ioniq 5. Based on the language in the email it's clear to me that Ioniq 5 won't be available until early 2022 (and only in limited quantities in limited states).
 

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I'm actually on the Ioniq 5 pre-order list (which I will cancel since I've decided to go ahead with my ID.4 AWD Pro S) and got an email from Hyundai USA yesterday about local events to check out the Ioniq 5. Based on the language in the email it's clear to me that Ioniq 5 won't be available until early 2022 (and only in limited quantities in limited states).
Perhaps they need to meet their Euro fleet emissions target yet, so they are allocating more cars to Europe. The chip shortage cannot help as well.
 

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I have 3 orders in for Ionic 5 in 3 different states, but no pricing, no real delivery timeframe and unlike the VW order, the Hyundai dealer can add whatever they want to the final price. I should never have bought that AZ land!
 

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Saw this article today:


“ The brand still expects to start cranking the EV out in October, but availability at "a majority of dealerships" won't happen until after December 21”

Suggesting that the change in language doesn’t really mean that ioniq5 production is delayed. Not sure if the original expectation for Fall 2021 meant September or December, but this suggests that TinMan may have hit it on the nose in terms of how Hyundai is thinking about it.
 

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My head (and wallet) say ID.4, but my heart prefers the Q4 -- I want the features of the European ID.4 (HUD, adaptive dampers, etc.) that VW America removed from the ID.4. I also like the fact that Audi's infotainment system is far ahead of VWs -- not that it is perfect but it doesn't have the issues (is already working on the various other eTron models). As for "availability," since I'm wanting an AWD and my order still hasn't locked, I suspect I could get the Q4 at least as quickly as my ID.4 will arrive.
 

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Discussion Starter · #40 ·
My head (and wallet) say ID.4, but my heart prefers the Q4 -- I want the features of the European ID.4 (HUD, adaptive dampers, etc.) that VW America removed from the ID.4. I also like the fact that Audi's infotainment system is far ahead of VWs -- not that it is perfect but it doesn't have the issues (is already working on the various other eTron models). As for "availability," since I'm wanting an AWD and my order still hasn't locked, I suspect I could get the Q4 at least as quickly as my ID.4 will arrive.
I fully agree with you. I really like the Q4 interior, but honestly prefer the ID.4 exterior design. The Q4 grill is too fossil-like for me (which maybe done on purpose). There is a car that is in-between both that I would get if I would live in Europe - Skoda Enyaq. Enyaq is not sold in US, Q4 availability in the US is according to my dealer 1-2 years out. I'm sure VW will consider adding some of the Euro features (and maybe even more) to later ID.4 models for the US... (So that we have some excitement with retro fitting :))
 
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