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Discussion Starter #1

Winter consumption test for ID4. @70m/h @ 40 degrees, the range was around 165 miles. Till Bjorn gets his hands one one, this is best estimate out there.
 

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Winter consumption test for ID4. @70m/h @ 40 degrees, the range was around 165 miles. Till Bjorn gets his hands one one, this is best estimate out there.
Well, that is not great. We have less than 40 here for several months, sometimes down into the 10s or even 0s.
 

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He did drive substantial portions at 80 miles/hour, so even though the average was 70 miles/hour the higher peak speeds will hurt efficiency. Still, the average efficiency of ~2.15 miles/kWh is pretty bad. He plugged in at 19% SoC and the car pulled 110kW at the start, averaging 87.6kW over 27 minutes to charge to 70%.
 

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Discussion Starter #4 (Edited)
It is not great. But it is winter and highway speeds which are both buzkills from a consumption perspective. Maybe the efficiency will be much better at mixed driving.
 

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Winter consumption test for ID4. @70m/h @ 40 degrees, the range was around 165 miles. Till Bjorn gets his hands one one, this is best estimate out there.
Intersting, the Chargeways app @ChristophW told us about ( Chargeway Company App ) predicts 167 miles range for 75 mph at 40 F.

(BTW, the Mach-E Chargeway predicted range for 10F (common here) 65 mph is pretty horrendous too)
 

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Battery tech is behind the curve. A couple of years from now things will be different and the price of EV's will be lower. If you must be an early adopter by all means buy now. Myself, I am just watching for a year or so.
 

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Battery tech is behind the curve. A couple of years from now things will be different and the price of EV's will be lower. If you must be an early adopter by all means buy now. Myself, I am just watching for a year or so.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
The way i think about is from a use case perspective. I have 0 use cases to travel more than 100 miles at a stretch during winters. But i can see people who are going on those long ski trips being concerned.
 

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Happy owner of a blue ID.4 FE
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130 kmh is 81 mph but wow, the car is thirstier than I hoped in winter.
This is pretty typical EV winter range derating, 30%ish + speed (at any temperature).

Take these warm weather predictions from Chargeway at 70F for example (still only theoretical and tweaked by their general experience):

at 70 degrees F:

55 mph - 275 miles
60 mph - 253 miles
65 mph - 232 miles
70 mph - 214 miles
75 mph - 197 miles
80 mph - 181 miles

Practically speaking, a driver can take some actions as range becomes a problem on any given leg. Least painful is to slow down, most painful is to turn the cabin heat down, then off in the winter.

The Volt, Bolt, Clarity, etc. all drop winter / speed EV (battery) range about this way (give or take for aerodynamics, weight, tires, etc.) for temperature and speed. The Hyundai Ioniq electric with heat pump (and, low weight and good aerodynamics) did a little better (15% for heat vs. 30% range loss due to cabin heat), but it was a little noisy (sounded like a tiny engine), and an ID.4 1st max review with heat pump noted some detectable vibration in the steering wheel. Only to say that the heat pump improves the situation, but comes with its own minor annoyances.

The Ioniq with heat pump is like the "glider" of EVs, lower power, more range. Until last year, Ioniq beat the M3 for efficiency.
 

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Report by Inside EV that Hyundai will introduce the Ioniq 5 next month. The Korean mfgs have been much more forward-thinking than the Japanese on EV's. For some unknown to me reason, they were fixated on Hydrogen-power until very recently. Another data point for those of us not necessarily needing to buy sooner, rather than later. Another cost to VW not getting ID.4 FE to us in Jan. I'd have one, now, but for that. Now, I'm doing wait and see.
 

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Report by Inside EV that Hyundai will introduce the Ioniq 5 next month. The Korean mfgs have been much more forward-thinking than the Japanese on EV's. For some unknown to me reason, they were fixated on Hydrogen-power until very recently. Another data point for those of us not necessarily needing to buy sooner, rather than later. Another cost to VW not getting ID.4 FE to us in Jan. I'd have one, now, but for that. Now, I'm doing wait and see.
The number of ID.4s that VW would have actually sold in the US prior to the announcement of another competitor (that will be how far away?) is a rounding error of the smallest precision. I know that within the bounds of this forum, everything can seem so impactful and critical, but if VW's entire years-long global sales plan for the ID.4 hinged on a couple thousand (at most) ID.4s being delivered to one market in a single month, then I've suddenly found myself in an alternate reality.

And to address the comment about the Ioniq setting the bar for features that you made in another thread, if VW didn't put forward a competitive effort up front, I don't expect that they're going to suddenly and immediately add a bunch of features soon. Changing their current plan would require some amount of time even if they made that decision. My First Edition is not going to be impacted at all by what Hyundai announces, but maybe a 2022 or US-built model could (depending upon material availability, cost, etc.)
 

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I was wondering, don't ALL vehicles suffer some amount of efficiency loss in colder weather? I don't have any data, but it might be interesting to understand the losses in other platforms, not just BEV. Certainly BEV efficiency loss seems to be more significant.
 

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I was wondering, don't ALL vehicles suffer some amount of efficiency loss in colder weather? I don't have any data, but it might be interesting to understand the losses in other platforms, not just BEV. Certainly BEV efficiency loss seems to be more significant.
My Golf TDI goes from 58mpg in the summer to 52mpg in the winter.
 

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I was wondering, don't ALL vehicles suffer some amount of efficiency loss in colder weather? I don't have any data, but it might be interesting to understand the losses in other platforms, not just BEV. Certainly BEV efficiency loss seems to be more significant.
Technically, yes, however, ICE cars have so much wasted energy/heat dissipation that the efficiency loss is mostly for short trips (3-4 miles). The car also uses the heat dissipation for the heater so once the car is warmed up, the heater doesn't use as much energy as an EV.
 
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