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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I have been lurking on this board since September, but first time post.

At first I had in an order for a Pro S, but got in on the second wave of 1st edition pre-orders. I have been trying to decide if I want the ID 4 or if I want a Tesla model Y. Happened to start a Tesla order a couple of days before they discontinued the Y SR, so I just barely got in under the wire since I had paid the $100 fee. Tesla surprised me by contacting me pretty quickly after I placed my order. I told them then that I wasn’t ready just yet and to hold off until the beginning of May. They contacted me again about two weeks ago to tell me that I might have to just get whatever SR is in inventory since they weren’t sure if they were still going to be making the Y SRs off the menu like Elon had initially tweeted.

So I am really trying to decide which car to get. The dealership that is set to get my 1st edition was not wanting to discuss any figure until they have my car, so I contacted a dealership in Dallas to see if they could get me a ballpark figure about how much my lease would be. They finally called me back last night with some numbers, based on what we had discussed.

I told them that I wanted to put another $1000 down, on top of the $500 that I’ve already paid. For a 36 month lease, 15,000 miles, it would be $699/month. Or a 39 month lease, 15K miles, $1500 down, $679 per month. Very disappointed. I currently have a Subaru lease for a car that was around $30,000, 15,000 miles per year, and it is $366/month and I put nothing down. I was expecting my monthly payment to be about 1.5 times more than my current lease. Not nearly double.

I can actually get the model YSR for $650 a month with the same roughly $1500 down, 15,000 mile per year lease. On my Tesla portal, it is showing that the car is $43K. So the Tesla and the 1st edition are roughly the same price. Approximately same down payment with the same number of miles. Even though the 1st edition has the $7500 tax credit, while the Tesla does not, it is still $50 a month more than the Tesla.

I have no idea what the money factor is on either one. I am strictly concerned with how much money I’m having to pay down and pay each month. I told the VW dealership that my credit score is 751, but I ran it last night and it is actually 766. It had been 794 until we refinanced our mortgage a few months ago and it looks like the hard pull hurt my credit a little.

After watching Kyle’s recent review, I had kind of decided that I would rather get the 1st edition. But not for $50 more per month than a Tesla.
 

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Thats too high. If you search here on lease FE you will see many posts of what people have been offered. The official VW website has been showing a lease on FE for $449 a month, see: Leasing info for FE but that is based on 10k miles. 15k doesn't raise it that high.
 
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Thats too high. If you search here on lease FE you will see many posts of what people have been offered. The official VW website has been showing a lease on FE for $449 a month, see: Leasing info for FE
that was for 10k miles and 3k down. But the difference between Tesla and ID4 boils down to residual value. If you are shopping between ID4 and Tesla SR, the Tesla will be the cheaper one to lease and ID4 cheaper to buy. Keep in mind that the Tesla SR range will be lesser than ID4 adjusting for the usual inflation of Tesla range
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Thats too high. If you search here on lease FE you will see many posts of what people have been offered. The official VW website has been showing a lease on FE for $449 a month, see: Leasing info for FE but that is based on 10k miles. 15k doesn't raise it that high.
It sounds too high to me also. On Tesla’s website, if I change it to 12K miles, it knocks it down $23. So if I go from a 10K mile lease to a 15K mile lease with VW, I wouldn’t expect it to change the payment by more than $50 a month. So should that make it around $500 per month if I put $3K down?

that was for 10k miles and 3k down. But the difference between Tesla and ID4 boils down to residual value. If you are shopping between ID4 and Tesla SR, the Tesla will be the cheaper one to lease and ID4 cheaper to buy. Keep in mind that the Tesla SR range will be lesser than ID4 adjusting for the usual inflation of Tesla range
So if I am putting down $1500 less, I would expect $1500 to come out to maybe $60/month more of a payment?(1500/36=41.66, so allowing $60 per month to take into account some interest?) So I would think maybe $449+ $50 more for miles+ $60 less down payment...maybe around $560 per month?

I think $699 per month is ridiculous.
 

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VW's advertised lease on their site is for a Pro model, at $379/month for a 36/10 lease, with $3,579 DAS from the customer, which includes $2,501 customer CCR (i.e., down payment). This monthly payment also assumes a "suggested dealer contribution" of $1,312.20 and a $7,500 "Lease Incentive" (i.e., the Federal tax credit). This is, of course, before taxes. If you reduce the DAS to $1,500 then you'd be raising the payment ~$58/month, which puts it at about $437/month. Upping the lease from 36/10 to 36/15, you're probably looking at about ~$475/month if I had to guess, just depends on VW's residuals. It's possible a 39-month term might help that, but it's also possible it might hurt it. Upgrading from the Pro to the Pro S will very likely increase the payment, but unless the residuals are super far off from the quoted Pro model, I cannot fathom why the Pros S would lease for nearly double the Pro rate. Unless, the dealer is really screwing you with the MF.
 

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I have been lurking on this board since September, but first time post.

At first I had in an order for a Pro S, but got in on the second wave of 1st edition pre-orders. I have been trying to decide if I want the ID 4 or if I want a Tesla model Y. Happened to start a Tesla order a couple of days before they discontinued the Y SR, so I just barely got in under the wire since I had paid the $100 fee. Tesla surprised me by contacting me pretty quickly after I placed my order. I told them then that I wasn’t ready just yet and to hold off until the beginning of May. They contacted me again about two weeks ago to tell me that I might have to just get whatever SR is in inventory since they weren’t sure if they were still going to be making the Y SRs off the menu like Elon had initially tweeted.

So I am really trying to decide which car to get. The dealership that is set to get my 1st edition was not wanting to discuss any figure until they have my car, so I contacted a dealership in Dallas to see if they could get me a ballpark figure about how much my lease would be. They finally called me back last night with some numbers, based on what we had discussed.

I told them that I wanted to put another $1000 down, on top of the $500 that I’ve already paid. For a 36 month lease, 15,000 miles, it would be $699/month. Or a 39 month lease, 15K miles, $1500 down, $679 per month. Very disappointed. I currently have a Subaru lease for a car that was around $30,000, 15,000 miles per year, and it is $366/month and I put nothing down. I was expecting my monthly payment to be about 1.5 times more than my current lease. Not nearly double.

I can actually get the model YSR for $650 a month with the same roughly $1500 down, 15,000 mile per year lease. On my Tesla portal, it is showing that the car is $43K. So the Tesla and the 1st edition are roughly the same price. Approximately same down payment with the same number of miles. Even though the 1st edition has the $7500 tax credit, while the Tesla does not, it is still $50 a month more than the Tesla.

I have no idea what the money factor is on either one. I am strictly concerned with how much money I’m having to pay down and pay each month. I told the VW dealership that my credit score is 751, but I ran it last night and it is actually 766. It had been 794 until we refinanced our mortgage a few months ago and it looks like the hard pull hurt my credit a little.

After watching Kyle’s recent review, I had kind of decided that I would rather get the 1st edition. But not for $50 more per month than a Tesla.
I'm wondering if they aren't including the $7,500 fed tax break.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
VW's advertised lease on their site is for a Pro model, at $379/month for a 36/10 lease, with $3,579 DAS from the customer, which includes $2,501 customer CCR (i.e., down payment). This monthly payment also assumes a "suggested dealer contribution" of $1,312.20 and a $7,500 "Lease Incentive" (i.e., the Federal tax credit). This is, of course, before taxes. If you reduce the DAS to $1,500 then you'd be raising the payment ~$58/month, which puts it at about $437/month. Upping the lease from 36/10 to 36/15, you're probably looking at about ~$475/month if I had to guess, just depends on VW's residuals. It's possible a 39-month term might help that, but it's also possible it might hurt it. Upgrading from the Pro to the Pro S will very likely increase the payment, but unless the residuals are super far off from the quoted Pro model, I cannot fathom why the Pros S would lease for nearly double the Pro rate. Unless, the dealer is really screwing you with the MF.
I like your numbers way better. I do have to wonder about what games they are playing.
 

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I like your numbers way better. I do have to wonder about what games they are playing.
Note thats a Pro with a much lower MSRP. The $449 number I gave above was for a FE like you quoted. Here is another thread with the 15k number computed at $574:
Final VW ID.4 Lease Numbers (March 2021) - Lease Calculator
and it links to the very nice Leasehackr Calculator where you can play with the numbers all you like. Note that link has the crazy 9.5% CA sales tax. Also the high CA registration fees and some dealer fees are added into that $574
 

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I like your numbers way better. I do have to wonder about what games they are playing.
Your handle suggests that you’re based in Texas, a state with tax rules that penalize leases because of how much VAT you have to pay. The numbers on the VW site do not reflect this. It’s probably worth checking whether your Tesla numbers already account for this.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Your handle suggests that you’re based in Texas, a state with tax rules that penalize leases because of how much VAT you have to pay. The numbers on the VW site do not reflect this. It’s probably worth checking whether your Tesla numbers already account for this.
Yes, you are correct that I’m in Texas. However we have done probably ten leases over the past ten years and never saw a price like this quote. Our most recent lease was in May 2020, when we leased my husband’s Subaru Forester Sport package for $441/month and the car was maybe around $31K. I think we paid TTL out of pocket. I think it was around $1200, maybe?? As I mentioned my Subaru Crosstrek is $366/month and paid nothing down, TTL rolled in.
 

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I did some playing with the leasehackr for you. TX has super high sales tax at up to 8.25%, and they charge it upfront on a lease which gets expensive in TX. So if you capitalize the tax to keep the down at $1087, it shows a lease at $687. Not any games they played, just a high tax rate and low downpayment.
Leasehackr for TX FE Note you put the residual at 46% for a 15k lease.

Note The mainstream brand that tops the industry with the highest residual values (like 70%) across their lineup is Subaru. EVs are typically lower residual since the tech changes fast. If we could only get that same 70% residual value, then a FE would be $401 a month changing that 1 number on the leasehackr.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
I did some playing with the leasehackr for you. TX has super high sales tax at up to 8.25%, and they charge it upfront on a lease which gets expensive in TX. So if you capitalize the tax to keep the down at $1087, it shows a lease at $687. Not any games they played, just a high tax rate and low downpayment.
Leasehackr for TX FE Note you put the residual at 46% for a 15k lease.
Strange that my current leases are $366 and $441 per month. I realize that the ID4 1st Edition is $43K and our two Subarus are around $30-$32K, but the tax credit should bring the $43K ID down to around $38K. So not that much different and as I mentioned nothing was put down on my Crosstrek and only paid around $1200 on the Forester. The tax rate has been the same for years, so it would have been 8.25% then, too.

So if the Forester with the sport package was around $31K. paid $1200 for TTL, nothing else down and lease of $441 per month. This was in May 2020. ID4 around $38K after tax credit, putting $1500 down, lease of $687? From $441/month to $687 is a HUGE difference.

And someone posted a screenshot the other day showing I think 515 a month for a lease on their 1st edition?
 

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Note The mainstream brand that tops the industry with the highest residual values (like 70%) across their lineup is Subaru. EVs are typically lower residual since the tech changes fast. If we could only get that same 70% residual value, then a FE would be $401 a month changing that 1 number on the leasehackr even in high tax TX. The FE is $45190 including the required $1195 destination fee we all pay.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Note The mainstream brand that tops the industry with the highest residual values (like 70%) across their lineup is Subaru. EVs are typically lower residual since the tech changes fast. If we could only get that same 70% residual value, then a FE would be $401 a month changing that 1 number on the leasehackr even in high tax TX. The FE is $45190 including the required $1195 destination fee we all pay.
Ah, that makes sense. I wonder if Tesla has a higher residual value.
 

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Ah, that makes sense. I wonder if Tesla has a higher residual value.
Yes Tesla has the highest residuals of any EV at about 59%, due to having the best current resale value of any car on the market. That will soon change with all the new competition. The new Audi Q4 Etron may be close to this residual, and a lease on it may come out cheaper than an ID.4 even though they cost more.
 
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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Yes Tesla has the highest residuals of any EV at about 59%, due to having the best current resale value of any car on the market. That will soon change with all the new competition. The new Audi Q4 Etron may be close to this residual, and a lease on it may come out cheaper than an ID.4 even though they cost more.
Sounds like I better jump on it while I can!
 

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Has anyone been able to get lease figures for a Pro 39,995$. Mine is in shipment and am trying to get potential pricing?
 

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Strange that my current leases are $366 and $441 per month. I realize that the ID4 1st Edition is $43K and our two Subarus are around $30-$32K, but the tax credit should bring the $43K ID down to around $38K. So not that much different and as I mentioned nothing was put down on my Crosstrek and only paid around $1200 on the Forester. The tax rate has been the same for years, so it would have been 8.25% then, too.

So if the Forester with the sport package was around $31K. paid $1200 for TTL, nothing else down and lease of $441 per month. This was in May 2020. ID4 around $38K after tax credit, putting $1500 down, lease of $687? From $441/month to $687 is a HUGE difference.

And someone posted a screenshot the other day showing I think 515 a month for a lease on their 1st edition?
Just to clarify, TX has a 6.25% vehicle tax on purchased and leased cars. Leasing in TX is harder because we are taxed at the full sale price of the vehicle versus most states you're just taxed on the monthly payment. Texas dealerships are allocated lease tax credits that they can apply to certain deals to offset the tax cost on leases, so that could have played a role on your previous leases.

Take this with a grain of salt - pulled these numbers from another site for the ID.4 in March:

10k miles
Lease term / MF / RV
36m / .00143 MF / 49% residual
39m / .00143 MF / 47% residual
48m / .00163 MF / 42% residual

12k miles - subtract 1% off 10k residuals
15k miles - subtract 3% off 10k residuals
 

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10k miles
Lease term / MF / RV
36m / .00143 MF / 49% residual
39m / .00143 MF / 47% residual
48m / .00163 MF / 42% residual

12k miles - subtract 1% off 10k residuals
15k miles - subtract 3% off 10k residuals
Does anyone by any chance know the residual/MF for 36 months/7.5K miles?

Thanks!
 
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