[Drew18]

I agree with ChristophW. I doubt a RWD Tesla Y would give you the 244 mile EPA range. Read the Car & Driver or Road & Track article where the Porsche Taycan is Compared to the Tesla S. They highlight why Teslas have the high EPA range that they do.

I think you should compare the WLTP instead. Tesla’s EPA figure is about 30% inflated due to Tesla performing two extra test cycles that other manufacturers do not. The difference between stated Tesla EPA and actual range is most noticeable at freeway speeds i.e. when range is the most important for road trips.

Besides the misleading range from Tesla and panel gaps, paint and quality control if you still are considering one, please take it for a test drive and perform a U-turn. Tesla’s turning radius is terrible.

In comparison the 250 mile estimated range from VW for the ID.4 was dead on and the the turning radius is better than a Porsche 911.

The early claims of the ID4 was upwards of 350 miles, so not dead on at all.

 

[FredT]

The early claims of the ID4 was upwards of 350 miles, so not dead on at all.

There's a big difference between a "claim" and an "estimate". VW never claimed a 350 mile range for the ID.4. As far as I know there only estimate for EPA range came last year and was 250 miles, which they hit exactly. If you can show otherwise, please do.

 

[eldecarlo]

There's a big difference between a "claim" and an "estimate". VW never claimed a 350 mile range for the ID.4. As far as I know there only estimate for EPA range came last year and was 250 miles, which they hit exactly. If you can show otherwise, please do.

I believe he was referring to Europe when they stated a 325 mile range. You are correct when they revealed it they stated 250. Prior to that it was all rumors.

 

[sprylo]

The early claims of the ID4 was upwards of 350 miles, so not dead on at all.

I can find no evidence of such a claim, at least not direct from VW. At the reveal of the ID CROZZ concept in April 2017, VW claimed a NEDC range of 500 km (311 miles). This claim was repeated in a September 2017 press release and rounded down to "up to 300 miles" in a November 2017 press release. At the time of the first "production" ID.4 reveal in March 2020, VW again claimed a 500km range, this time WLTP. And when the final vehicle was rolled out in September 2020, they claimed 520km (323 miles) WLTP for the large battery. I can find no claimed EPA ranges in any VW press releases prior to September 2020.

 

[ID4000]

Does this really bother you guys so much? This new Model Y and ID.4 are roughly the same... Especially when you consider actual range and not EPA. Good grief...

 

[Boma]

I just went and did a test drive of the Model Y Performance model, which of course is the only one they had available for test drives here in Fresno. This was the first time I've ever been behind the wheels of ANY sort of EV. Hands down, it is an absolutely beautiful car and its acceleration is like a rocket ship. I do think though that it's too tech centric for its own good. I'm 35 years old and am incredibly tech savy - I could likely build my own computer but I couldn't tell you exactly what every piece did - and felt like it was too much. In order to adjust the mirrors or steering wheel, you have to use the tablet. If you want to open the glove box, you have to use the tablet. While the screen was huge, there were a LOT of different menus to pick from to find what I wanted so I don't think I could do it on the fly while I'm driving.

I'm not sure if this is a Tesla thing or a standard EV thing but it was very weird letting go of the gas and having the car come to a stop shortly after. There was no way to let the car coast on inertia, at least that I could see, and I felt like I was getting whiplash everytime I took my foot off the brake.

I'm not ruling out the Model Y just yet - I would want to test drive the Standard range RWD model to do a true comparison - but as of right now, I am likely sticking with my ID4 Pro reservation.

The regenerative braking mode in Tesla’s can be reduced to low from standard and regarding one pedal driving, I set mine to creep So the car retains some forward momentum. Havimg driven my car for twenty months with the stopping mode in hold, allowing the car to creep feels more natural and seems to be more efficient, especially when it comes to highway driving. Tech savvy owners get used to the screen very quickly. The latest updates have formatted the screen differently but the menus are quite easy to navigate through even if they sometimes require you to take your eye off the road. I tend to throw the autopilot on for these times and take it off after making any required adjustments. I’m quite concerned about the fidelity of the main displays on all the EVs that serve as competitors to Tesla. The clarity of the 15” display on the 3 is outstanding and having the navigation in Earth view means normal sat nav seems very boring. One thing I will miss is the acceleration, the cars are rocket ships and moving to a slower accelerating car is another big cause for concern. Lastly Electrify America will have to make a big step up to satisfy those of us planning on getting an ID.4. In my neck of the woods I have multiple options for DC fast charging but only one EA location and that is where Tesla has the major advantage over everyone else.

 

[Boma]

Another factor is performance, if that is something you would want. MY standard range RWD will do 0-60 in 5.3 sec. The ID is closer to 7.5. Not a big deal for most people but I’d like a little more pep. I’m still in limbo after canceling my ID in December. I may hold out for a couple more months.

I’m in the same boat. My Model 3 Mid Range gets to 60mph in 5 seconds and now it feels slow! Looking at the Hyundai 45 or Kia CW now and if range and acceleration are as rumors suggest then those will be better options for me than the ID.4.

 

[FredT]

I’m in the same boat. My Model 3 Mid Range gets to 60mph in 5 seconds and now it feels slow! Looking at the Hyundai 45 or Kia CW now and if range and acceleration are as rumors suggest then those will be better options for me than the ID.4.

Why are you interested in the ID.4?

 

[Doctor Zaius]

Wow... For me this is a game changer... Look at the standard features of the RWD Model Y compared to the ID.4, literally the only thing ID.4 has going for it is the manufacturing. With the RWD Model Y you still get the premium interior, meaningful software upgrades, and the option of FSD (I'm not interested though, I like driving my car)... Not to mention as stated in another post, that Tesla is going to hold its value alot better than the ID.4

The con list for the ID.4 just keeps growing...

Tesla has advantages in some areas, but you're understating the VW advantages when you say, "literally the only thing ID.4 has going for it is the manufacturing." I followed the Model Y forums pretty closely and a major complaint of many people is the harsh (stiff) suspension. The soundproofing leaves a lot to be desired, as well, per the forums. On the other hand, reviewers who have driven the ID4 such as Tom Moloughney and Kyle from Out of Spec Motoring both said it drives very smoothly and is very quiet. The ID4 also comes with 3 years of free charging. It also has a nice automatic shade covering the glass roof. It looks nicer than the Y (in my opinion). It has more usable space in the trunk since the Y has a sloping roofline. ID4 has SeriusXM option. Some of the active safety features are better on the ID4, such as rear-cross-traffic alerts (a personal favorite). Federal tax credit. Android & Apple Car Play. And probably some others.

I am somewhat of a Tesla fanboy, so I'm not trying to oversell the VW. Both the Y and the ID4 have different features that will appeal to different people. I'm just saying it's not as black-and-white as you stated. The ID4 has a lot of features that still make me lean towards purchasing, personally. But maybe some of those things aren't as important to other folks as they are to me.

 

[Boma]

Why are you interested in the ID.4?

Price, features and three years of free charging are attractions.

 

[Reeler]

Buying a VW avoids the annoying Tesla fanbois too. LoL. Having Apple Carplay on the VW is a big motivator for me.

Tesla has the best proprietary nav, but you have to pay $10/month after the first year to get it to update in real time. My phone is way better with more media & map options. Tesla loves proprietary solutions so will probably never join the rest of the car brands in supporting the phones.

 

[TT97]

Buying a VW avoids the annoying Tesla fanbois too. LoL. Having Apple Carplay on the VW is a big motivator for me.

Tesla has the best proprietary nav, but you have to pay $10/month after the first year to get it to update in real time. My phone is way better with more media & map options. Tesla loves proprietary solutions so will probably never join the rest of the car brands in supporting the phones.

Good luck avoiding Tesla fanbois driving around in a non-Tesla EV!

Stupid distinction, but with the standard connectivity on the Tesla, you still get real-time traffic-based routing/rerouting, you just don't get the visualization on the map (I am guessing those yellow and red lines along roads are heavy bandwidth intensive!) Without premium, you also don't get any music streaming, satellite view, internet browser and worst of all, no CARAOKE!

Does anyone know if VW Car-Net is free lifetime?

 

[Huey52]

For comparison, Audi's satellite Nav (a tech package option) connectivity is free for the life of vehicle, although the mapping data updates are becoming cost bearing in out years.

Audi Connect, which is their cellular "Car-Net" equivalent, is only free for 4 years. I was paying $10/mo. to AT&T in my 5th year to retain. However I recently cancelled when they broke up with Google Maps and lost the very nice cellular overlay to the Nav, as that's the only feature of the in-car 'net that I regularly used (iPhone Siri now handling everything else).

But perhaps VW has a better deal?

...
Does anyone know if VW Car-Net is free lifetime?

 

[RocketVol]

For comparison, Audi's satellite Nav (a tech package option) connectivity is free for the life of vehicle, although the mapping data updates are becoming cost bearing in out years.

Audi Connect, which is their cellular "Car-Net" equivalent, is only free for 4 years. I was paying $10/mo. to AT&T in my 5th year to retain. However I recently cancelled when they broke up with Google Maps and lost the very nice cellular overlay to the Nav, as that's the only feature of the in-car 'net that I regularly used (iPhone Siri now handling everything else).

But perhaps VW has a better deal?

looks like it is free for the first 5 years for all of the basics, with the nav suppport including weather and traffic being $49/year

Plan Pricing - car-net (vw.com)

 

[TT97]

looks like it is free for the first 5 years for all of the basics, with the nav suppport including weather and traffic being $49/year

Plan Pricing - car-net (vw.com)

That pricing is confusing. It's $49 but you need an "active data plan." How much is the data plan? Is the free "remote access" considered to be a data plan?

Also, $9 a year to be able to use voice commands seems to be a slap in the face.

 

[RocketVol]

That pricing is confusing. It's $49 but you need an "active data plan." How much is the data plan? Is the free "remote access" considered to be a data plan?

Also, $9 a year to be able to use voice commands seems to be a slap in the face.

I had the same thoughts, but I am assuming (a dangerous thing) that the data plan is the basic Car-Net service. The $20/month verizon thing seems to just be for a hotspot, and the car needs a data plan of some type to just make the basic Car-Net stuff work....sooooo I think it means that you need the basic Car-Net service working first.

On the voice commands, again I had the same initial reaction, but in the fine print it says "This package option is for MY21 vehicles equipped with a factory-installed MIB3 infotainment without a factory installed navigation system" so it is for those without nav and just the standard radio. Voice commands should be a part of the standard ID.4 setup with no charge

 

[Huey52]

Typically voice commands are included with a Nav - Tech package (both Audi and Benz in my experience)

 

[TT97]

I had the same thoughts, but I am assuming (a dangerous thing) that the data plan is the basic Car-Net service. The $20/month verizon thing seems to just be for a hotspot, and the car needs a data plan of some type to just make the basic Car-Net stuff work....sooooo I think it means that you need the basic Car-Net service working first.

On the voice commands, again I had the same initial reaction, but in the fine print it says "This package option is for MY21 vehicles equipped with a factory-installed MIB3 infotainment without a factory installed navigation system" so it is for those without nav and just the standard radio. Voice commands should be a part of the standard ID.4 setup with no charge

Thanks, I missed the "out" part of without - reads completely different now. I see the same applies to online radio. And as an added benefit, the nav support find gas stations!!! [I know that is meant for their other cars.] The Tesla navigation points out gas stations on occasion as well and I never understood why they can't turn off those landmarks.

 

[Aero247]

The regenerative braking mode in Tesla’s can be reduced to low from standard and regarding one pedal driving, I set mine to creep So the car retains some forward momentum. Havimg driven my car for twenty months with the stopping mode in hold, allowing the car to creep feels more natural and seems to be more efficient, especially when it comes to highway driving. Tech savvy owners get used to the screen very quickly. The latest updates have formatted the screen differently but the menus are quite easy to navigate through even if they sometimes require you to take your eye off the road. I tend to throw the autopilot on for these times and take it off after making any required adjustments. I’m quite concerned about the fidelity of the main displays on all the EVs that serve as competitors to Tesla. The clarity of the 15” display on the 3 is outstanding and having the navigation in Earth view means normal sat nav seems very boring. One thing I will miss is the acceleration, the cars are rocket ships and moving to a slower accelerating car is another big cause for concern. Lastly Electrify America will have to make a big step up to satisfy those of us planning on getting an ID.4. In my neck of the woods I have multiple options for DC fast charging but only one EA location and that is where Tesla has the major advantage over everyone else.

I just took a look and the new Tesla's don't actually allow you to reduce the regenerative breaking any more.

 

[TT97]

I just took a look and the new Tesla's don't actually allow you to reduce the regenerative breaking any more.

Weird. Just checked my 3 and it still has low regen although I haven't gotten an OTA in over a week but should be on the most recent update. I wonder if it has to do with the EPA rating.