[Johnny_id4]

Hi Community,

I just picked up my id4 this weekend and totally love the car. Got myself a Black id.4 Pro S. First post here as well.

I had a question about possibly buying an Electrify America L2 charger for my mobile home in California.

Outside my carport, it looks like there is already a plug for the charger. I took a photo of the circuit breaker, the plug outlet, and some technical info posted near it. I hope someone can confirm with me that I would be able to just buy the charger and it would simply be a "plug and charge" without any professional installation needed?

Also, if this is a "plug and charge", without professional installation needed, would I still need a permit from the state?

Thanks,
Johnny

 

[Eric (Oregon)]

I suggest you spring for an electrical contractor to look at it first.

 

[redcdale]

I suggest you spring for an electrical contractor to look at it first.

I would agree. From your pictures, you may have a dangerous electrical setup. If those circuit breakers are protecting the outlets below them, it looks like the NEMA 14-50 outlet may be protected by a 100 amp circuit breaker. NEMA 14-50 outlets should be protected by a breaker of no more than 50 amps, and you should get an EVSE that pulls no more than 40 amps continuously (80% rule).

Congrats on your ID.4, though! To answer your other question, if the electrical is wired and protected properly, you should not need a permit to plug an appropriate EVSE into the outlet.

 

[Tinman]

I suggest you spring for an electrical contractor to look at it first.

Yeah, it looks like the intent is to comply with the California EVSE requirement. A 20A circuit for any Level 1 EVSE and a NEMA 14-50 receptacle for 40A Level 2. The use of 100 A breakers in that box is inexplicable, unless there's something we're not seeing.

Edit in Post #18. I think we're seeing a sub-fed panel, with its circuit breaker near the service entrance.

 

[Johnny_id4]

Thanks everyone for the input, I will have this check out with a professional.

 

[Mrpmg]

Doesn’t NEC Article 625 only require that the overcurrent protection and conductor size be a MINIMUM of 125% of the EVSE? Doesn’t an EVSE have its own internal overcurrent protection as well?

 

[redcdale]

Doesn’t NEC Article 625 only require that the overcurrent protection and conductor size be a MINIMUM of 125% of the EVSE? Doesn’t an EVSE have its own internal overcurrent protection as well?

That's correct, as far as sizing an EVSE to a correctly installed circuit and breaker. The concern I was expressing above is that the circuit breaker and the NEMA 14-50 receptacle may not be sized correctly for each other. The receptacle, and most likely the wiring, can only handle a max of 50 amps, while the breaker appears to be a 100 amp breaker. This would be a clear fire hazard if the load pulls more than 50 amps but less than 100 (the breaker won't trip, causing the wiring and/or receptacle to overheat).

 

[Mrpmg]

Presumably that wouldn’t occur, since any equipment with a NEMA 14-50 or 6-50 plug won’t draw more than 50A (or in the case of a continuous load, 40A). This is sort of like 20A appliance circuits with 15A receptacles, except the EVSE receptacle is the only one on the circuit.

 

[Mrpmg]

And my assumption was the breaker and conductor were appropriately sized for 100A, with a 50A receptacle on the end.

 

[redcdale]

Presumably that wouldn’t occur, since any equipment with a NEMA 14-50 or 6-50 plug won’t draw more than 50A (or in the case of a continuous load, 40A). This is sort of like 20A appliance circuits with 15A receptacles, except the EVSE receptacle is the only one on the circuit.

Doesn't that assume that the equipment functions correctly 100% of the time? I would think the circuit breaker should also help protect against possible problems with the load. I'll admit, I'm not an expert on the code, so maybe it's OK, but it seems to me that it would pretty significantly reduce the safety of a circuit to have a breaker that's double the expected load of a circuit (especially in the case of a misbehaving load).

But as was pointed out earlier, we might not have all the information (such as conductor size, or how it's wired up, etc.), so that's why we suggested that someone qualified check it out first.

 

[gorj]

Don't waste your funds on an electrician, just remove the 100 breaker and replace it with a 50 amp breaker and you will be fine. BUT, turn off the main power first. Since there is a 100 amp breaker there I am sure the wiring from the breaker to the 14-50 receptacle can carry the load of your EVSE. It should a #6 wire, with a red wire, a black wire, a white wire and a bare copper wire. The red and black are the hot wires, the white is the neutral, and the bare copper is the ground. Personally I can not imagine anyone using a 100 amp breaker for a 14-50 outlet.

 

[redcdale]

Don't waste your funds on an electrician, just remove the 100 breaker and replace it with a 50 amp breaker and you will be fine. BUT, turn off the main power first. Since there is a 100 amp breaker there I am sure the wiring from the breaker to the 14-50 receptacle can carry the load of your EVSE. It should a #6 wire, with a red wire, a black wire, a white wire and a bare copper wire. The red and black are the hot wires, the white is the neutral, and the bare copper is the ground. Personally I can not imagine anyone using a 100 amp breaker for a 14-50 outlet.

That's probably what I would do, but I'm a big DIY kind of person...

 

[Mrpmg]

Yes, I’m uncertain as well. Breakers are usually there to protect the circuit, not the load, e.g. trying to run three hair dryers concurrently on a 20A circuit.

Many Level 2 EVSEs have software selectable amperages to match to the car’s capabilities, so an EVSE may be set at 20A, even if capable of 40A or 50A. The circuit would still be sized for 125% of the highest continuous load, but if the EVSE, for whatever reason, started delivering too much amperage, the load might be damaged, but the circuit protected.

 

[Eric (Oregon)]

From the sound of it, J should not be touching anything. He made the right choice..an electrican.

 

[VW TECHNICIAN]

You will only need to use two more breaker spaces and from looking at your distribution box you have enough space for 3 more.
Otherwise you are set for whatever else comes in the future.... 80 amp is going to be top end for 150+ Kwh battery packs.

 

[Spin]

Don't waste your funds on an electrician, just remove the 100 breaker and replace it with a 50 amp breaker and you will be fine. BUT, turn off the main power first. Since there is a 100 amp breaker there I am sure the wiring from the breaker to the 14-50 receptacle can carry the load of your EVSE. It should a #6 wire, with a red wire, a black wire, a white wire and a bare copper wire. The red and black are the hot wires, the white is the neutral, and the bare copper is the ground. Personally I can not imagine anyone using a 100 amp breaker for a 14-50 outlet.

I would get a free estimate from an electrician. As @gorj said, it looks like you just need a breaker change which is very simple, and if he has one on the truck he might only charge you about $100 to do the job right then. The breaker costs about $20 and it can be done in about 10 minutes.

 

[fiehlsport]

Chances are you are fine and that NEMA 14-50 is protected by a breaker that is oversized for the circuit. There isn't a safety issue by using a 40A EVSE on it. It's peculiar they chose that breaker unless they also wired it using conductors sized for 100A as well. (Possibly future-proofing as someone else stated)

 

[Tinman]

Chances are you are fine and that NEMA 14-50 is protected by a breaker that is oversized for the circuit. There isn't a safety issue by using a 40A EVSE on it. It's peculiar they chose that breaker unless they also wired it using conductors sized for 100A as well. (Possibly future-proofing as someone else stated)

It is probably a sub-fed panel using the preinstalled breakers as "Service Disconnects", in conjunction with the affixed label. The proof would be a dedicated protection circuit breaker back at a main service panel or CSED near a meter base. I'll bet that's what this installation is.

 

[Johnny_id4]

@Tinman : Yes, this NEMA14-50 plug is located right under the meter base covered.