[scdald21]

Wanting to get thoughts on the range differences between 2WD and 4WD.

I've heard there is around a 10% hit for a 4WD compared to 2WD. So if it's 250 EPA miles for 2WD, that would mean that 4WD would be 225.

I'm hoping/fingers crossed, that the 2WD is closer to 280 miles EPA, so 4WD would be closer to 250ish.

 

[TT97]

The Skoda Enyaq iV in Europe (which is a reskinned ID.4) has a 10% hit on the AWD model (WLTP Range) so guessing ID.4 will have an equivalent difference. The WLTP is 320 miles for RWD and 290 for AWD (WLTP is more "optimistic" than EPA range).

Škoda Enyaq - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[eldecarlo]

I asked that question yesterday with VW. They put me on hold and came back and said it will be basically the same. I was on the phone with them for 15 minutes. I had about 10 questions.

 

[Kitt]

Lol, VW also claimed the wheel size doesn't impact range. Yet if the AWD lowers the range by 10% and larger wheels a few additional percentage point, and the impact of colder weather due to the lack of a heat pump... it adds up quickly. The support and social media teams at VW don't seem very informed when it comes to EVs, they also suggested I could buy an aftermarket heat pump for the ID.4. 🤨

If the numbers in the article linked below are still accurate, the Enyaq would have an EPA range of 285 miles (258 for AWD). The Enyaq is a little bit bigger than the ID.4. The cars aren't as efficient as Teslas, but it would be a decent range.

WLTP to EPA conversion

 

[ChristophW]

If the numbers in the article linked below are still accurate, the Enyaq would have an EPA range of 285 miles (258 for AWD). The Enyaq is a little bit bigger than the ID.4. The cars aren't as efficient as Teslas, but it would be a decent range.

WLTP to EPA conversion

I think that linked article is overly optimistic. A newer article at InsideEVs shows stats for WLTP vs EPA range that all over the map.

• Average: 1.14
• Median: 1.11 (half of the models have higher and half of the models have lower result)
• Max: 1.42
• Min: 0.90

Those extremes have me worried. VW's own 324 miles WLTP vs. 250 miles EPA results in a 1.29 conversion factor. I really hope it will be significantly lower once a true EPA range is established.

 

[Kitt]

So worst case that would be an EPA range of about 225 miles. Yikes, that would be disappointing: 100 miles less than a bigger Model Y that comes with a slightly smaller battery.

 

[RobertS]

Lol, VW also claimed the wheel size doesn't impact range. Yet if the AWD lowers the range by 10% and larger wheels a few additional percentage point, and the impact of colder weather due to the lack of a heat pump... it adds up quickly. The support and social media teams at VW don't seem very informed when it comes to EVs, they also suggested I could buy an aftermarket heat pump for the ID.4. 🤨

If the numbers in the article linked below are still accurate, the Enyaq would have an EPA range of 285 miles (258 for AWD). The Enyaq is a little bit bigger than the ID.4. The cars aren't as efficient as Teslas, but it would be a decent range.

WLTP to EPA conversion

Yeah, tire type and size can make a huge difference on an EV's range.

Pilot Sport 4S Tires Turned My VW e-Golf Into a Grip Master

I don't know of any other five-passenger hatchbacks that can pull a full g on a dusty skidpad and still return 119 MPGe.

www.roadandtrack.com

 

[NBCGLX]

In my own personal experience with an i3 BEV (has heat pump) and i3 REx (no heat pump), the expectation that having a heat pump is going to be some magical fix for cold weather driving just isn’t realistic. I’d predict that having a heat pump would have a marginal effect on cold weather range, if any noticeable effect at all. It does produce instant heat, so I’ll give it that. The AWD ID.4 will have a heated windscreen, and I venture to say that will have a better effect on cold weather driving than a heat pump will, since one won’t have to run the front defroster or defogger on blast to keep the windshield free of frost/snow/fog.

 

[emtonsti]

The heat pump provides about a 15% improvement in winter range hit in the Hyundai Ioniq electric (limited trim, the base model does not have the heat pump), already a very efficient EV. I am skeptical of the VW UK claims of 30% improvement, especially down to ultra cold temps, but 15% to 20% might be more realistic, at least over a wide range of winter temperatures.

 

[NBCGLX]

The heat pump provides about a 15% improvement in winter range hit in the Hyundai Ioniq electric (limited trim, the base model does not have the heat pump), already a very efficient EV. I am skeptical of the VW UK claims of 30% improvement, especially down to ultra cold temps, but 15% to 20% might be more realistic, at least over a wide range of winter temperatures.

Is that what Hyundai claims? Not sure how they could verify that in the real world unless the Ioniq Electric is also available without a heat pump??

 

[emtonsti]

Is that what Hyundai claims? Not sure how they could verify that in the real world unless the Ioniq Electric is also available without a heat pump??

I have the limited with the heat pump, it can do its rated 125 miles through winter [Correction - maybe down 10% to 15% winter below 125], in summer, even without careful driving, the range jumps up to over 150 miles. Most U.S. Ioniq electric are the base model without the heat pump (I'm talking all 2019 model year). There are forums just like this one for the Ioniq where folks talk about real world testing.

Actually, it's kind of funny by analogy to our ID.4 discussions, I think when they increased the battery size in the 2020 Ioniq electric, they also dropped the heat pump from all of the U.S. trims (not sure, just what I remember when reading about the 2020s).

Also, it should probably be mentioned that the heat pump can make some noises, pretty sure it's the heat pump, sometimes it sounds like I have a tiny engine up front there.

 

[NBCGLX]

I have the limited with the heat pump, it can do its rated 125 miles through winter, in summer, even without careful driving, the range jumps up to over 150 miles. Most U.S. Ioniq electric are the base model without the heat pump (I'm talking all 2019 model year). There are forums just like this one for the Ioniq where folks talk about real world testing.

Actually, it's kind of funny by analogy to our ID.4 discussions, I think when they increased the battery size in the 2020 Ioniq electric, they also dropped the heat pump from all of the U.S. trims (not sure, just what I remember when reading about the 2020s).

Also, it should probably be mentioned that the heat pump can make some noises, pretty sure it's the heat pump, sometimes it sounds like I have a tiny engine up front there.

I wonder if that’s Hyundai purposefully rating the range based on “worst case” operating conditions, because anything better is obviously just a bonus, but less disappointment in cold weather? We all remember Hyundai/Kia getting their wrists slapped for overstating fuel economy on their ICE cars a few years back.

Yes, the heat pump does sound like a little engine or something. Maybe more like a portable electric air pump you might fill your tires with. Catches quite a few folks off guard if you don’t know what it is!

 

[ChristophW]

So worst case that would be an EPA range of about 225 miles. Yikes, that would be disappointing: 100 miles less than a bigger Model Y that comes with a slightly smaller battery.

I doubt that we are going to see the worst case. The outliers in the stats I mentioned worry me when people claim they can convert one range to another with decent accuracy.

I expect VW was quite conservative when they estimated EPA range. They've seen the negative PR around Porsche Taycan range, and then later for the Polestar 2 and Vovlo XC40 Recharge. Any sane manager would underestimate and overdeliver in the current climate.

 

[eVDub]

We should be super critical about real-world range. ID.3's might help with figuring that out. Has anyone looked into those numbers?