[Tardisman]

ID4 does NOT have battery conditioning, but if you YO-YO the vehicle it will warm up the battery.

What is YO-YOing you ask. Put the vehicle in "B" mode, and alternate repeatedly between throttle and off throttle. This will cycle the battery between discharging and charging which WILL heat the battery up.

 

[nmerk]

Honestly, my choice is more driven by trying to just find one that works...at all. Sometimes it's the 350kw, sometimes it's the 150kw. At many of the stations, the only 150kw charger is the older shared one with the Chademo, which I'm generally going to use as my last choice if anything else is available. When it's cold out and my car is cold I'm only getting like 30-40kw anyway, which unfortunately is every time I go to charge these last few months. If I get above like 70kw, it's a lucky day.

 

[ChristophW]

In a recent Rivian roadtrip video where Kyle was mostly documenting the terribly low charge rate of a Rivian on a roadtrip, there was an ID4 driver who pulled up to the 350 kW dispenser and insisted that he needed 350 kW badly, even after Kyle (reportedly) gently showed him the dispensed rate. I believe in the same video was another EV that was long full and still connected, and the driver sleeping.
He is not without reason when pointing out nonsensical and inconsiderate behavior.

 

[rman]

In a recent Rivian roadtrip video where Kyle was mostly documenting the terribly low charge rate of a Rivian on a roadtrip, there was an ID4 driver who pulled up to the 350 kW dispenser and insisted that he needed 350 kW badly, even after Kyle (reportedly) gently showed him the dispensed rate. I believe in the same video was another EV that was long full and still connected, and the driver sleeping.
He is not without reason when pointing out nonsensical and inconsiderate behavior.

I went to my local EA last weekend which is only three 150 units. The middle unit was broken and has been for awhile. When I got there the two working units both had id.4s connected with one at 96% and the owner no where to be found. The second working unit was at 99% with the owner watching the screen. He told me he’d be finished in 3 minutes. I don’t know why id.4 owners are more susceptible to charging to 100% more often but it certainly does happen quite a lot.

 

[Enzeder]

Has everyone here seen this post?

Charging Calculator

Not sure that this will answer our questions,but: Here is a link to the VW Ireland site with a calculator that demonstrates the effect of temperature and starting SOC on the charging rate. Charge Simulator | E-Mobility Tools | Volkswagen Ireland

www.vwidtalk.com

I tried it. It seems wildly optimistic!! For example, I've plugged in at 20°C and got 150 kW. And I've plugged in at 10°C and got 80 kW. But the simulator estimates a 2 min difference (going from 20-80%).

In a recent Rivian roadtrip video where Kyle was mostly documenting the terribly low charge rate of a Rivian on a roadtrip, there was an ID4 driver who pulled up to the 350 kW dispenser and insisted that he needed 350 kW badly, even after Kyle (reportedly) gently showed him the dispensed rate. I believe in the same video was another EV that was long full and still connected, and the driver sleeping.
He is not without reason when pointing out nonsensical and inconsiderate behavior.

But a good YouTuber should consider their audience. I would bet that most folks that have taken the time to land on one of his videos are more self aware than the willfully or blissfully ignorant. And if folks are pure noobs that really do want to learn, then don't be so condescending.

I went to my local EA last weekend which is only three 150 units. The middle unit was broken and has been for awhile. When I got there the two working units both had id.4s connected with one at 96% and the owner no where to be found. The second working unit was at 99% with the owner watching the screen. He told me he’d be finished in 3 minutes. I don’t know why id.4 owners are more susceptible to charging to 100% more often but it certainly does happen quite a lot.

$5 says they were '21's. That should diminish in a few years as the unlimited charging plans expire. Unfortunately, VW incentivized that behavior.

 

[Dougie01]

Also there is the question of how many people bother to read the instruction manual.

 

[tochi312]

In a recent Rivian roadtrip video where Kyle was mostly documenting the terribly low charge rate of a Rivian on a roadtrip, there was an ID4 driver who pulled up to the 350 kW dispenser and insisted that he needed 350 kW badly, even after Kyle (reportedly) gently showed him the dispensed rate. I believe in the same video was another EV that was long full and still connected, and the driver sleeping.
He is not without reason when pointing out nonsensical and inconsiderate behavior.

It is about the way it is being done. He could have used a better way of communicating his frustration instead of alienating a certain class or cars.

 

[eb2143]

It is about the way it is being done. He could have used a better way of communicating his frustration instead of alienating a certain class or cars.

if you watch all of his videos though, I saw one recently (IIRC the Hyundai preconditioning update video possibly), where an ID4 owner came and left after charging to 60-70 percent, and he said something to the effect of

"You know we kid about ID4 owners, 95% of them are absolutely great but it does seem like 5% ...."

I don't totally understand him singling out ID4 mainly because that's just not what I see here. I don't find any pattern to charging etiquette issues by what the owner is driving. it tends to be very slow top charging cars like BMW i3, old Hyundai Ioniq, Kia Niro and Bolts that I see spending the most time sitting on chargers to 100%, but that's because they're charging at level 2 speeds whereas a new 2023 ID4 with the SK battery apparently rips
at the top and only starts tapering from 90 kilowatts at 90% state of charge, and the older ID4s are still decent.

Anyway, I think people need to lighten up a bit about one YouTuber ragging a bit on some ID4 owners.

 

[ericy]

Kyle and Branden both made their channels on the back of the ID.4, now they are likely getting sponsorships from other brands and VW (as far as I can tell) doesn't pay for influencer marketing, so suddenly the ID.4 sucks ass. Take anything you hear on monetized YouTube channel with a grain of salt. Maybe an entire salt lick.

Some of Kyle's complaints have to do with the pace of software updates, so his complaints aren't all unfair.

 

[ErickF]

VW's communication and engagement with influencers is probably very similar to that of it's customers. Around the ID.4 launch, Dustin Krause was reaching out and created a model for how VoA should engage. He didn't adopt the corporate playbook. I think influencers are frustrated the level access and benefits wasn't maintained.

 

[ericy]

I tried it. It seems wildly optimistic!! For example, I've plugged in at 20°C and got 150 kW. And I've plugged in at 10°C and got 80 kW. But the simulator estimates a 2 min difference (going from 20-80%).


But a good YouTuber should consider their audience. I would bet that most folks that have taken the time to land on one of his videos are more self aware than the willfully or blissfully ignorant. And if folks are pure noobs that really do want to learn, then don't be so condescending.


$5 says they were '21's. That should diminish in a few years as the unlimited charging plans expire. Unfortunately, VW incentivized that behavior.

Numerous people are saying that generous free charging plans are a bad idea. It incentives people to not bother installing a home L2, and instead use DCFC, and this increases congestion.

 

[ChristophW]

Numerous people are saying that generous free charging plans are a bad idea. It incentives people to not bother installing a home L2, and instead use DCFC, and this increases congestion.

I would agree.
However, being a member of the unlimited charging class and having multiple EA locations within a sub 20min drive, I never drive out to DC fast charge. Just not worth my time, even if I were retired already. I must be an outlier.

 

[truthseeker]

The only thing I'll add is that the "don't use 350s" guidance is becoming increasingly obsolete as Electrify America replaces many of the 150s with 350s (or doesn't install 150s at all, like at its two newest sites in Alabama), leaving at most just one 150 kW charger per site that's shared with CHAdeMO.

Not tying up the CHAdeMO, so you don't strand a Leaf, is much more critical than some EV6 owner (assuming they're not "Coldgated") having to spend another 5-10 minutes in a Walmart parking lot IMHO.

The only rule I follow is not to use the pedestal with CHAddMo if there are other ones available in case a rare Leaf shows up. Other than that, I’m not going to choose a 150 kw charger when a 350 kW is available in the summer time. In the winter, I may choose 150 kW one because I know I will never get even close to 150 kW. Frankly, I haven’t seen a single EV charging at EA that can exceed 150 kW in the winter.

 

[jatrax]

I would agree.
However, being a member of the unlimited charging class and having multiple EA locations within a sub 20min drive, I never drive out to DC fast charge. Just not worth my time, even if I were retired already. I must be an outlier.

Not an outlier. I have an EA station 10 minutes away and likely will never use it. I have L2 in the garage, why would I sit in a parking lot to charge when I can be at home on my couch? To save $6?

I get that people think "I paid for that, so I'm going to use it" but I've better things to do that sit at a charging station for a free charge.

I also get that "three years of free fuel" is a great sales tool. Our salesman brought that up repeatedly, even though he really didn't need to 'sell' us at all. And it does sound great if you are coming from an ICE car. But the reality is less impressive.

 

[rman]

Not an outlier. I have an EA station 10 minutes away and likely will never use it. I have L2 in the garage, why would I sit in a parking lot to charge when I can be at home on my couch? To save $6?

I get that people think "I paid for that, so I'm going to use it" but I've better things to do that sit at a charging station for a free charge.

I also get that "three years of free fuel" is a great sales tool. Our salesman brought that up repeatedly, even though he really didn't need to 'sell' us at all. And it does sound great if you are coming from an ICE car. But the reality is less impressive.

Same here - there is an EA charger 10 minutes away - the only time I use it is if I happen to be going to Target (where the EA is located) and I need a little juice. I will not go out of my way to save the $5 it would take to fill it in my garage.

 

[truthseeker]

I don’t know why id.4 owners are more susceptible to charging to 100% more often but it certainly does happen quite a lot.

You don’t know? Do you want me to tell you?

 

[CTNP]

I agree with the notion that EA free charging likely results in congestion at local stations. I have one close to me (1 mile) that is also at the grocery store I use most frequently. I charge there when I'm low and picking up groceries but never to fill up. It is definitely an issue though for folks that live in apartment complexes and maybe those with older homes where an electrical upgrade might be necessary even just to get a 240V outlet installed in the garage or outside. So, there are some nuances to this. I'd honestly rather have VW pay for an L2 EVSE in my garage like Chevy does with QMerit. There are local incentives for much of the country but dependent on the cost of the installation and if there are no local incentives, it may still cost a bit. I'm lucky, I needed to have some electrical work done and after everything it was $3000 (including the L2 charger) but $900 come back from federal incentives and $1000 come back (in the form of a rebate) from my local utility, and then there are incentives of participating on off-peak charging for $50/mo credit for June-Sep, so that's $200/yr, so after 5 years, it's basically cost me nothing to install. But some people don't have the local incentives and it might be difficult. How often am I going to go on trips long enough to need DCFC. Will that equal the cost of electrical installation: definitely not. I'd rather see more assistance with L2 home installation. The vast majority (dependent on location [see other threads]) spend less on electricity than gas, so the cost savings is already built in. It feels like they're treating it similar to FCEVs where they offer $15,000 or 6 years of hydrogen...but that's because hydrogen is expensive and there are very, very few stations (i.e. southern California and one station in Hawaii if I remember correctly)

 

[Froggy]

It is 24 miles one way to EA. It costs $450 for a 40 amp Clippercreek. The set up was $850 for 60 feet of wire, a 50 amp breaker, a sub panel, a wire junction box and a licensed electrician. No permit required if a licensed electrician installed it. That was in August 2021. No I do use the EA if I happen to be passing by, typically once a week.

 

[Spongedart12]

I have to disagree with you guys that free charging is bad. To me, it's a great incentive that can take some worry off the shoulders of non EV enthusiasts who just want a car, but are not sure how they will charge it. Some do not have access to level 2 charging, a person in a condo or apartment complex may not be allowed to install a L2 unit, and free charging can still get them into a car. I think a positive thing that can come from this is that these Charge companies will see the complaints of not having enough chargers nearby, thus making it more viable to create new charging areas, some a lot closer to neighborhoods and homes. At least, I hope that's how it plays out.

 

[bigbill25]

Kyle and Branden both made their channels on the back of the ID.4, now they are likely getting sponsorships from other brands and VW (as far as I can tell) doesn't pay for influencer marketing, so suddenly the ID.4 sucks ass. Take anything you hear on monetized YouTube channel with a grain of salt. Maybe an entire salt lick.

I know Kyle says he doesn't take sponsorships from car manufacturers or own any stock in them. He does for adjacent brands like Magna, Nokian and I saw some sponsored video for some L2 charger recently.