Received this tonight from VW. Disappointed they aren’t pushing something out like Nissan and others but understand why. Hopefully dealers can work quickly to make this happen - and hopefully VW is helping them with that.

 

Got the email - went to my dealer's website and it is unreachable. I suspect dealer websites are hosted centrally by VW of America and they did mass email to reservation holders and those reservation holders have now overwhelmed their webserver trying to contact dealerships across US to ask about contracts.

 

Pinged my dealer, ondering if they are jumping on this..

 

I’m wondering if they manually updated a bunch to 05 to fix the incorrect delivery dates but also 05 means order accepted. That may have more importance in the eyes of the IRS when considering a transition vehicle. Order accepted vs order locked? Maybe take a screenshot of your new 05s with the date and time? Maybe this is a VW wink, wink, nod, nod?
Just guessing though.

 

My dealer was all over this! (Armstrong in Gladstone Oregon)

I signed a docuSign agreement this morning.

Hope it works out!

 

Did you have a VIN or what was your status code? I may see if I can switch to them if no dealers in WA want to do anything about about getting a contract out.

 

I wrote up my own binding contract yesterday (before VW's notice last night). It said that I am making a binding contract to purchase the car (Order # XXXXX) once it is available, at the list price plus tax,title, license fees, and that if I don't complete the purchase I forfeit my deposit (the dealer general manager was actually that it was refundable, but I said that I'd prefer my language to strengthen the case that this is a binding purchase commitment). The dealer sales manager signed & emailed it back (so I have a time stamp). NOTE: I recommend doing before the President signs the new law-- could be any time now.

 

I got an email from my car dealer alerting me of the matter after I replied to this post. They said I would only lose $100.00 of my refundable deposit after if I chose to sign the binding agreement but all $500.00 would still be toward the purchase of the car. I am waiting to hear back from the car dealer.

 

Signed my buyers order but should take delivery before tuesday. You just need a executed buyers order with the vin, msrp blah blah. Dealer would need the invoice. I'm sure they'll need to have some kind of clue that it will be in within 30 days of that. Usually, that means a "Released to Carrier" status. Most go out 10 days or less after that status.

 

First, some background on vehicle eligibility. Volkswagen expects but cannot guarantee, that each of the Model Year 2022 and Model Year 2023 ID.4 vehicles meet the requirements for EV Tax Credit qualification under the provisions of 30D(d)(1) of the Internal Revenue Code of 1986.

Does anyone understand this part of the email, especially the "Model Year 2022" part? Why would VW execpt that MY2022 vehicles, made in Germany, will be eligible? Unless the "provisions of 30D(d)(1)..." are referring to the OLD tax credit? In which case it's a little confusing to word it that way - and a little odd to even mention it, given that there are NO restrictions whatsoever under the old EV tax credit (except battery size and the 200k cap - but even the 200k cap has a 6 month expiration window once it's hit).

I am a 2022 reservation holder who will likely be over the $300k income limit come next April (but am under it now). I originally was thinking I could purchase before filing taxes next year because the new credit is POS (and would be based on my prior year's tax return)...but now I think that POS system won't come into affect for a year. Which means I need to purchase it this year I think...IDK!

 

First, some background on vehicle eligibility. Volkswagen expects but cannot guarantee, that each of the Model Year 2022 and Model Year 2023 ID.4 vehicles meet the requirements for EV Tax Credit qualification under the provisions of 30D(d)(1) of the Internal Revenue Code of 1986.

Does anyone understand this part of the email, especially the "Model Year 2022" part? Why would VW execpt that MY2022 vehicles, made in Germany, will be eligible? Unless the "provisions of 30D(d)(1)..." are referring to the OLD tax credit? In which case it's a little confusing to word it that way - and a little odd to even mention it, given that there are NO restrictions whatsoever under the old EV tax credit (except battery size and the 200k cap - but even the 200k cap has a 6 month expiration window once it's hit).

I am a 2022 reservation holder who will likely be over the $300k income limit come next April (but am under it now). I originally was thinking I could purchase before filing taxes next year because the new credit is POS (and would be based on my prior year's tax return)...but now I think that POS system won't come into affect for a year. Which means I need to purchase it this year I think...IDK!

Re: "Model Year 2022 and Model Year 2023 ID.4 vehicles meet the requirements for EV Tax Credit qualification under the provisions of 30D(d)(1) of the Internal Revenue Code of 1986. "

What they are saying, I believe, is that the two model years would qualify for full credits under the rules in place prior to signing of the Bill.

If I remember correctly, the tax credit applies to the year you put the car in service.

Dave

 

👀 Following. I'm getting the same no-can-do from my local dealership in the SF Bay Area.

 

As requested.

‘‘(10) LIMITATION BASED ON MODIFIED AD- JUSTED GROSS INCOME.—
‘‘(A) IN GENERAL.—No credit shall be al- lowed under subsection (a) for any taxable year if—
‘‘(i) the lesser of—
‘‘(I) the modified adjusted gross
income of the taxpayer for such tax- able year, or
‘‘(II) the modified adjusted gross income of the taxpayer for the pre- ceding taxable year, exceeds
‘‘(ii) the threshold amount.
‘‘(B) THRESHOLD AMOUNT.—For purposes of subparagraph (A)(ii), the threshold amount shall be—
‘‘(i) in the case of a joint return or a surviving spouse (as defined in section 2(a)), $300,000,
‘‘(ii) in the case of a head of house-
hold (as defined in section 2(b)), $225,000, and
‘‘(iii) in the case of a taxpayer not de- scribed in clause (i) or (ii), $150,000.
‘‘(C) MODIFIED ADJUSTED GROSS IN-
COME.—For purposes of this paragraph, the term ‘modified adjusted gross income’ means adjusted gross income increased by any amount excluded from gross income under section 911, 931, or 933.

 

Once the income limits take effect for cars delivered in 2023, you have the option of taking the current years income or the prior years income (which ever is less) to determine eligibility.

 

In 2024 when they do the point of sale tax rebate (Transfer of Credit) they do not have to verify that your income meets the limit. You will get the tax credit then if you want it. However, when you file your taxes for that year VW reports to the IRS that you already received the tax credit. If you do not qualify due to income limits (or other reasons), you will owe the tax credit back to the IRS.

1. (4) TRANSFER OF CREDIT.—The amendments
2. 13 made by subsection (g) shall apply to vehicles placed
3. 14 in service after December 31, 2023.

1. (10) RECAPTURE.—In the case of any tax-
2. 14 payer who has made an election described in para-
3. 15 graph (1) with respect to a new clean vehicle and re-
4. 16 ceived a payment described in paragraph (2)(C)
5. 17 from an eligible entity, if the credit under subsection
6. 18 (a) would otherwise (but for this subsection) not be
7. 19 allowable to such taxpayer pursuant to the applica-
8. 20 tion of subsection (f)(10), the tax imposed on such
9. 21 taxpayer under this chapter for the taxable year in
10. 22 which such vehicle was placed in service shall be in-
11. 23 creased by the amount of the payment received by
12. 24 such taxpayer.’’.

 

" I am debating canceling my 2022 order and placing a 2023 order instead since that model will most likely be covered by the tax credit even after the law change. "
---------------------------------------------

Be aware that the 2023 may get $0 tax credit, it may get $3750 credit, but it is unlikely to get $7500. Much is not known yet about how the battery restrictions provisions will be implemented or measured.

Dave

 

Is everyone in agreement that there are no income levels to worry about for 2022 buyers? If so, then as long as it’s delivered in ‘22 we need no binding contract, no?

 

Apparently only the made in North America clause will apply the moment Biden signs the text. All other requirements will apply from January 1st onwards or once the Secretary provides guidance (again, most interpretations are these will be effective Jan 1st)

 

My dealer just told me the state of California doesn’t allow them to enter into a bindin contract without a VIN.
So, that means CA buyers are hosed regardless of income qualifications because the EV is made in Germany.
am I assuming correctly?

 

My dealer just told me the state of California doesn’t allow them to enter into a bindin contract without a VIN.
So, that means CA buyers are hosed regardless of income qualifications because the EV is made in Germany.
am I assuming correctly?

No one really knows for sure until the IRS releases guidance about what constitutes a valid “binding” contract. Could be that having a locked order turns out to be enough. Or not.

Anyone claiming to have a certain answer one way or another is actually just speculating. It’s the uncertainty that’s pushing people to get something signed to try to cover their bases. It could turn out that a signed “buyer’s order” might not even be enough and that only an actual sales contract with VIN and itemized price is accepted. But no one knows for sure. I’m just raising possible things that could happen.

 

if this is true anyone who gets 22 ID4 after signing of IRA is out of luck, there will be no tax credit

not sure how they came up with 5%
"The IRS said "if a customer has made a non-refundable deposit or down payment of 5% of the total contract price, it is an indication of a binding contract."

U.S. says about 20 models will get EV credits through end of 2022

The Biden administration said on Tuesday about 20 models will still qualify for electric vehicle tax credits of up to $7,500 through the end of 2022 under legislation signed by President Joe Biden.

www.reuters.com

 

There has been some discussion about this in another thread, and it essentially sounds like the IRS is deferring to state contract law and provided that as an example. But it certainly isn't the news many of us were hoping for.

 

If your are retired as I am, you might be in for a surprise with the right off on taxes. I owed no taxes last year when I bought the Id4. The $7500 was totally lost to me. If you owe nothing then the right off is worthless. Also you can not carry it forth to the next year. But I bought the car any whey and I am still happy.

 

Yeah, that’s the drawback with it being a credit, hopefully with the change in how it works (I think effective 2024?) more people can take advantage of it as a point of sale rebate essentially (technically a refundable credit). It’s unfortunate it was a surprise to you though, and a very disappointing one at that.

 

My dealer (Shearer VW in South Burlington Vermont) failed me on multiple levels.

I own one ID4 (delivered in April 2021). I ordered a second ID4 this past winter. I contacted my dealer to inquire about getting a binding sales contract and the first response was "you should have received that when you picked up the vehicle".

Mind you, I forwarded the email from VW that was specifically about this issue of ordered but not yet delivered vehicles. I followed up with them and explained that I had ordered a second vehicle and that is what I was asking about.

The response to that was a couple of things. First was the whole legalise about consulting a tax advisor...they can not assure anyone they will qualify... blah blah blah. The second (which should have been the lead) was that they could not do a sales contract without a VIN.

Of course, if I had the VIN, I would know if it was coming from TN or Germany.

I canceled my order.

 

Looks like US battery producers and EV manufactures are in position for some nice tax credits themselves...

The climate bill President Biden signed into law yesterday will open up tens of billions of dollars in subsidies for high-tech electric vehicle plants across the South and the Midwest.

Why it matters: The package is a big down payment on addressing climate change and moving toward energy independence as the U.S. races to build a domestic supply chain for batteries and other critical materials.

• It could also be a major economic jolt for a large swath of the country some are calling the Battery Belt, where lots of EV-related factories and facilities are being built.

Driving the news: The auto industry has already poured billions into new EV and battery manufacturing facilities across North America over the last couple years.

• Now automakers and battery suppliers will be eligible for billions of dollars in federal loans and tax credits to offset those costs and spur additional investments.

For example: The government will provide a tax credit of $35 per kilowatt hour (kWh) for each U.S.-produced battery cell.

• That's 35% of today's average cost of producing a battery cell.
• Ford, for instance, could get a $3 billion tax break for the twin factories it's building in Kentucky, which will be able to produce 86 gigawatt hours' worth of batteries annually. (The IRS still has to figure out how exactly the credits will work.)

There's also a tax credit for U.S.-produced battery modules — groups of cells bundled together that fit inside a battery pack.

• At $10/kWh, the credit would whack about one-third off the cost of assembling an EV battery pack, according to Bloomberg NEF.

Critical materials and minerals produced in the U.S. also get a 10% tax credit under the new law.

• That will help companies like Redwood Materials, which is investing $3.5 billion in Nevada for cathode and anode processing — essential work in the battery production process that's currently done mostly overseas.

There's also $2 billion in grants to retool existing auto plants to make clean vehicles, and up to $20 billion more in loans to build new factories.

The intrigue: And yet automakers aren't happy about the law, largely because its strict supply chain requirements mean far fewer electric vehicles will qualify for big consumer tax credits right off the bat.


Yes, but: Over time, reshoring battery production should drive down the cost of EVs — and lessen U.S. dependence on China.

• The optimists' view: By incentivizing a domestic EV component supply chain, the law will help reduce automakers' costs — and they'll pass those savings along to consumers in the form of cheaper electric cars.

Between the lines: In essence, the U.S. has shifted the incentives for EV adoption from consumers to manufacturers — instead of making electrics cheaper for car buyers, the new law rewards carmakers for building EVs with U.S.-made batteries.

• Lawmakers are not "just putting on new rules and saying, 'good luck.' They're putting tens of billions of dollars on the table to help [automakers] get there," said Joe Britton, executive director of the Zero Emission Transportation Association.

The bottom line: Automakers' scramble to meet domestic content requirements will lead to a rapid build-out of manufacturing capacity for electric vehicles, batteries, and the components and materials required to produce them.

 

Hello, although I have a ID4 reserved, the sales guy called me several weeks ago. Stating if I was interested in possibly purchasing another ID4, just different color. I said yes, so we had an appointment. The vehicle arrived earlier than anticipated, the dealer sold it without notifying me that it was there. This was before the I.R.A. was signed by the president. Now, I went and asked about the binding contract. So, I could still get my tax credit. They said NO. They are not trying to work with me. Now, I'm considering of canceling my reservation just because the way they have treated me. Is it possible to change dealership on my reservation, although I'm lock in on configurations? The dealer by the way is Imperial Valley Volkswagen in California.

 

Hmmm, I'm not sure if it's too late to change your dealer or not. I would recommend contacting VW Customer Service and asking them. It probably depends on how far along in the process your car is.

 

Their default answer is no. You will probably have to escalate and see if you can change it that way.

 

I reserved 2022 in mid Aug. It has been changed to 2023. Is it possible to get it before 2023 in order to claim tax credit. I believe 2023 will be made in US.

 

If you are still at the $100 deposit you probably won't be seeing a car in 2022.

 

As far as I know. It is possible to get it by the end of the year. I reserved mine in July. I called VW and was told by the end of the year (Nov 1st -Dec. 31st).

 

Reserved March 2021. Picked up August 26, did not sign anything prior as I thought it only kicked in 1/1. Did I just pay 20% more for my ID4 than I expected? Sounds like it.

 

Unfortunately that does appear to be the case right now. I would suggest contacting your dealer to see if they'll back date something for you. You could also try claiming the credit using your reservation as justification, but that's obviously a personal choice that may carry risk. Hopefully you can get something sorted out - maybe since you already bought the car from them they'll be more willing to work with you on back dating something?