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The new bill would give tax refunds on buying used EVs, meaning that market is about to heat up even more. Interesting times...
Not necessarily. There are dealers now who are selling below MSRP while their peers are tacking on additional markups. That's the one argument for dealerships.
 

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The new bill would give tax refunds on buying used EVs, meaning that market is about to heat up even more. Interesting times...
If I remember the specs right. The EV has to be three years old, cost $25,000 or less, it must be sold through a dealer, and the $4000 can only be claimed once during the life of the vehicle. It should resale a lot of Bolts though.
 

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Discussion Starter · #125 ·
I wouldn't mind a used Bolt for my younger daughter. I loved mine for the three years I had one.
It's to small for me but the new model Bolt's are really quite nice, and drive very nicely. It would be a great car for someone in college, good safety features but not loaded with every feature that could be distracting to a young driver.
 

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I test drove a Nissan Ariya today and was thoroughly impressed. The interior finishes were a big step above the ID4 and I loved the rearview camera, HUD, 360 camera and that enormous instrument cluster. It felt very Infiniti-like. I recommend anyone with an Ariya reservation to give it a really good look. I still think the ID4 has better acceleration and much more cargo space than the Ariya, and the ID4 is a better value but that diminishes with every price increase from VW. Now that my ID4 order is slipping into the timeframe of the Ariya launch, the next 6 months are going to be interesting!
 

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Discussion Starter · #127 ·
I test drove a Nissan Ariya today and was thoroughly impressed. The interior finishes were a big step above the ID4 and I loved the rearview camera, HUD, 360 camera and that enormous instrument cluster. It felt very Infiniti-like. I recommend anyone with an Ariya reservation to give it a really good look. I still think the ID4 has better acceleration and much more cargo space than the Ariya, and the ID4 is a better value but that diminishes with every price increase from VW. Now that my ID4 order is slipping into the timeframe of the Ariya launch, the next 6 months are going to be interesting!
Wow, you're lucky to have a dealer with one / access to one. The one near me hopes to have one to show people by Christmas. Sounds like they oversold them by 3 years so if someone hasn't reserved when they were open it's going to be a long wait or they are going to need a lot of cancelations.
 

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Now it depends on where the vehicle is made, where the battery is assembled, and where the battery materials are sourced. Of course my 3021 should do for years to come . Twice this week I have seen people eyeballing it in parking lots.
 

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Wow, you're lucky to have a dealer with one / access to one. The one near me hopes to have one to show people by Christmas. Sounds like they oversold them by 3 years so if someone hasn't reserved when they were open it's going to be a long wait or they are going to need a lot of cancelations.
It was actually at a Ride & Drive Event for reservation holders hosted by Nissan (not a dealer). It was a tightly controlled test drive on a short parking lot track with a Nissan employee in the car. And yes, I’m sure they have more orders than cars they can produce in a reasonable amount of time so I can’t count VW out yet. The new EV tax rebate rules could also throw another curveball if Ariya delivery slips to 2023 so it’s still a toss up. o_O
 

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Discussion Starter · #133 ·
It was actually at a Ride & Drive Event for reservation holders hosted by Nissan (not a dealer). It was a tightly controlled test drive on a short parking lot track with a Nissan employee in the car. And yes, I’m sure they have more orders than cars they can produce in a reasonable amount of time so I can’t count VW out yet. The new EV tax rebate rules could also throw another curveball if Ariya delivery slips to 2023 so it’s still a toss up. o_O
The dealer I spoke with seemed to be overly honest, I chuckled when he said they cut off reservations at 3 years of planned capacity, as they assume a large number will cancel, he then said but that's hasn't been the case for makers like VW. I got the feeling by his Christmas remark that they expect Nissan to ship a token amount this year to dealers so they can call it shipping but they are not really expecting many deliveries until early next year.
 

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The dealer I spoke with seemed to be overly honest, I chuckled when he said they cut off reservations at 3 years of planned capacity, as they assume a large number will cancel, he then said but that's hasn't been the case for makers like VW. I got the feeling by his Christmas remark that they expect Nissan to ship a token amount this year to dealers so they can call it shipping but they are not really expecting many deliveries until early next year.
FWIW, when I placed a Lyriq (pre)order, the dealer told me they expect 10% of orders to turn into a sale. Roughly 200,000 orders -> 20,000 sales.
 

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Discussion Starter · #135 ·
FWIW, when I placed a Lyriq (pre)order, the dealer told me they expect 10% of orders to turn into a sale. Roughly 200,000 orders -> 20,000 sales.
I know GM has said the plant could build 200,000 a year eventually, I would guess 200k was probably 3 years of production at ramp up. If they were really planning for a 10?% conversion rate, I would have to ask why they expect to to be so much lower than Ford, VW, Hyundai and Kia.
 

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I know GM has said the plant could build 200,000 a year eventually, I would guess 200k was probably 3 years of production at ramp up. If they were really planning for a 10?% conversion rate, I would have to ask why they expect to to be so much lower than Ford, VW, Hyundai and Kia.
I thought 10% seemed low as well, but figure they have experts making those predictions. Has any EV maker released hard numbers on conversion rates?
 

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Discussion Starter · #137 ·
I thought 10% seemed low as well, but figure they have experts making those predictions. Has any EV maker released hard numbers on conversion rates?
I've not seen anything official. Electrek has estimated Tesla to be in the 25% range, but that's pre-order lock. Haven't seen anything post order lock. The Hummer EV was claimed to be near 100% but given the dealer model, I would suspect a significant number of those didn't actually go to the original person that ordered it and was actually delivered by the dealer to someone else at a huge markup. I would guess that manufactures like VW have a fair number that cancel between the reservation ($100) and order ($500) as it's refundable. GM for the Blazer EV the reservation fee is refundable but once you go to order the order deposit is non-refundable so I would think they would get less cancelations after that point.
 

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We have a Ford Escape that is getting long in the tooth. I was thinking of replacing it with a Ford F150 Lightning but after looking at one, it is just too big for our needs. Ford recently announced they are going to be electrifying another pick up. Most pundits think it will be a Ranger which would be a better fit. I just hope my Escape lasts until they start delivering the new Ranger Lightning/Thunder in 4-5 years.
 

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Discussion Starter · #139 ·
We have a Ford Escape that is getting long in the tooth. I was thinking of replacing it with a Ford F150 Lightning but after looking at one, it is just too big for our needs. Ford recently announced they are going to be electrifying another pick up. Most pundits think it will be a Ranger which would be a better fit. I just hope my Escape lasts until they start delivering the new Ranger Lightning/Thunder in 4-5 years.
I would buy a F150 Lightning tomorrow if I could, it's big for my truck needs, but for me an EV truck is prefect. The 3 year wait not so perfect.
 

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We have a Ford Escape that is getting long in the tooth. I was thinking of replacing it with a Ford F150 Lightning but after looking at one, it is just too big for our needs. Ford recently announced they are going to be electrifying another pick up. Most pundits think it will be a Ranger which would be a better fit. I just hope my Escape lasts until they start delivering the new Ranger Lightning/Thunder in 4-5 years.
Ford trademarked the name Ranger Lightning and Maverick Lightning in Europe. Ranger Thunder, Maverick Thunder, and F-150 Thunder in the U.S. Some pundits think that means fully electric trucks for Europe, plug-in hybrid trucks for the U.S. I'm hoping for fully electric small trucks in the U.S. Surely in 4-5 years like you suggested. Ford Files trademarks
 
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