[Atlant]

https://www.montrealgazette.com/news/article761898.html

Audi EV ‘is a lemon,’ Quebec class action alleges

By Jack Wilson
Updated February 19, 2025 9:52 AM

Owners of Audi e-trons say battery-related issues have stopped their cars from working,
and the vehicle line was not properly tested before being sold.
Allen McInnis Montreal Gazette

Audi electric vehicle drivers are suing the automaker, alleging the cars it sells are defective and unsafe. The class-action suit follows claims from some drivers — especially of the Q4 e-tron — that battery-related issues have stopped their cars from working.

Filed at a Montreal courthouse Feb. 12, the application for the class action aims to represent all Quebecers who have purchased or leased a vehicle from the company’s EV line: Audi e-tron. It seeks $5,000 in punitive damages per driver on top of damages related to alleged losses. A statement from Audi said the company is investigating complaints, but didn’t respond directly to the lawsuit.

n January, The Gazette spoke with three Audi Q4 drivers who said that battery issues had prevented their electric vehicles from starting. One driver, Mylène Dionne, said she’d experienced issues five times driving three separate Q4s. That included one incident in which she said her car had partially shut off while driving full speed down the highway.

“The Audi e-tron is a lemon, suffers from many serious defects, was not adequately tested before being sold and was clearly not ready to be put on the market,” the lawsuit alleges.

Audi “has been aware of the safety issues in its e-tron vehicles for several years and has concealed it from its customers,” it continues.

The issues are “not just limited to the Q4,” said Joey Zukran, whose law firm LPC Avocats filed the class action with attorney Michael Vathilakis from Renno Vathilakis. But Zukran said the Q4 is most affected, especially the 2022, 2023 and 2024 models.

A Facebook group for Quebec Q4 drivers facing problems with their vehicles now counts close to 600 members.

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[Moe]

https://www.jdpower.com/business/press-releases/2025-us-vehicle-dependability-study-vds

.

 

[Enzeder]

Well, damn. Those JD numbers are bleak. For all the grief people give Tesla about build quality, at least they are mid pack. I assume this survey does not measure panel gaps, but hey. I'm also assuming that there is no breakdown by fuel type. IE: If VW had issues with coil packs or whatever, that shows up in the numbers. Of course the same would be true for Chevy.

I was going to say, "When you've been beaten by X, you know you have problems.", but VW have literally been beaten by everyone!!!

Side note, I'd love to see how the charger system reliability surveys look now. Just from my anecdotal experience at EA, 2024 was much better than 2023 and 2022.

 

[MikeQBF]

"When you've been beaten by X, you know you have problems.", but VW have literally been beaten by everyone!!!

Especially Stellantis companies, all having deserved reputations for shoddy product.

 

[Fahrer]

Let's not forget that the spread is not very wide. The best have almost 1.5 problems per 100. The worst have almost 3 problems per 100. There is also no mention of the severity of the problems encountered with each brand. Decades ago that spread was much worse than it is today.

Finally, beside the pandemic affecting most, is not all brands, the European brands had more exposure to the impact of the war affecting Ukraine which supplies some components ( e.g. wiring harnesses).

 

[Nai3t]

This will be a case of me making excuses for VW, except that I'll just offer that relative to all the other brands they're ranked at the bottom of that survey, there's no disputing that.

But I don't think there's a direct relationship between the very serious problem reported in @Atlant's first post (cars dying mid trip) and this JD Power survey.

The Power survey is a 3-year look back and these are some of the current-day hot spots:

• starter battery failures
• outdated maps
• Android Auto/Apple Car Play problems
• voice recognition problems

JD Power writes "The increase in problems in the technology area shows the importance that over-the-air updates can play in correcting issues," which is morbidly humorous seeing as how they're looking at three years of ownership of 2022 models and the VW OTA system has been "coming up to speed" to put it charitably.

The study covers 184 specific problem areas across nine major vehicle categories: climate; driving assistance; driving experience; exterior; features/controls/displays; infotainment; interior; powertrain; and seats. So while VW's ranking of 2.9 problems per vehicle is the worst in the list (no denying it!), it's mostly likely not because of their cars dying on the highway, but because of complaints of window switches, capacitive controls, slow/locked-up/blank infotainment screens, etc... the day-to-day stuff we are all familiar with.

JD Power goes on to write: "Infotainment systems continue to be most problematic: The infotainment category continues to be the most problematic with an average of 49.9 PP100—almost twice as many problems as the next-highest category, which is exterior. Six of the top 10 problem areas in the study are infotainment-related..."

 

[Sparkszenfahren]

Regarding charger reliability, there is this report from 2024 at ChargerHelp! | EV Charger Repair
report is free but you have to register to get it

It has some interesting graphics

 

[MikeQBF]

I'm going to state the merely obvious here - the more complex a system, the more perceived failure points there are going to be.

The Power survey is a 3-year look back and these are some of the current-day hot spots:

• starter battery failures
• outdated maps
• Android Auto/Apple Car Play problems
• voice recognition problems

Which makes my point. Three out of four are absolutely not integral to reliable operation of a transportation appliance. Modern cars have become complex beyond their utility.

 

[Enzeder]

Especially Stellantis companies, all having deserved reputations for shoddy product.

Yeah. I was thinking Alfa, Land Rover, etc. Folks love to bang on about the Koreans, but Kia is in the top half of this survey. Who'd a thunk Kia would pummel VW in a reliability survey?? I got to drive my Mum's EV6 over a 4 week period and thought it was great. Maybe not the best, but there was nothing that would exclude it from my future cross shopping list.

 

[Enzeder]

Regarding charger reliability, there is this report from 2024 at ChargerHelp! | EV Charger Repair
report is free but you have to register to get it

I'd be curious to see that first graph for 202 and 2024.

I was thinking of a survey I saw comparing charge point provider's reliability. EA did poorly a year or two ago, but I wonder how they are doing more recently.

 

[Nai3t]

Hyundais and Kias tend to get bagged on for poor long term wear and tear, difficulty of reparability, lack of parts support. I'm not piling on -- I don't have any first hand experience with that brand.

This JD Power survey in particular seems to factor in many of the day-to-day things we live with, as I shared infotainment and controls quirks are an oversized part of the mix. My assumption is button layout sucks and touchscreen is buggy on day one, it's not going to get any worse, it just is what it is (though in our case the capacitive controls were refined in the 3.1 release, and the infotainment has gotten progressively better with each update).

 

[Ida Red]

I think it is kind of strange that the class action is for all Audi e-trons which is both under and over inclusive.

OTOH, there are e-trons that are based on other platforms that don't have the same problems as the Q4.

OTOH, the Q4 is an MEB platform car and if there are alleging battery problems (not clear if they mean the traction battery or the 12V battery?) then the id.4 should be part of the class.

All in all, my impression is that the lawyers are just on a fishing expedition and don't really know what they are talking about or they would have defined the class differently.

 

[Nai3t]

the lawyers are just on a fishing expedition and don't really know what they are talking about

Agreed, and this line speaks volumes: "was not adequately tested before being sold." I'd love to see what they have to back up that assertion. Even if the 12 volt system is deficient we know VW and Audi tested the snot out of it and that they know dang well what its weak points are.

 

[Ida Red]

Hyundais and Kias tend to get bagged on for poor long term wear and tear, difficulty of reparability, lack of parts support. I'm not piling on -- I don't have any first hand experience with that brand.

This JD Power survey in particular seems to factor in many of the day-to-day things we live with, as I shared infotainment and controls quirks are an oversized part of the mix. My assumption is button layout sucks and touchscreen is buggy on day one, it's not going to get any worse, it just is what it is (though in our case the capacitive controls were refined in the 3.1 release, and the infotainment has gotten progressively better with each update).

Hyundai/Kia has had some serious problems with premature engine failure on their Theta series 4 cyl. motors. There have been a number of recalls and class actions where they have had to agree to pay for replacement motors.

I have a 2016 Genesis with the Lambda series V6 motor and have had no problems with the motor (and exactly one warranty claim - the center bearing in the driveshaft was causing a vibration at a certain speed). Then again I have low miles on the car. The Lambda is considered to be "good" by Hyundai standards but I don't think that they will go 300,000 miles like a Toyota motor. "Good" for a Hyundai means that the motor makes it to 150k miles.

 

[knash]

When I had to buy a vehicle, 3ish yrs ago, I really was interested in the ID4 or Q4 but they both had long wait lists and the lease rates were stupid. People were paying 1200/1300 CAD per month. Now it's 830ish. Even at that number it's not incredibly appealing given the huge depreciation. I'm so happy I didn't buy. I went and bought a X1. Now I'm up for a new car and all of these issues does not make me want to buy either of these. I think it's going to be a BMW i4.

 

[Atlant]

Agreed, and this line speaks volumes: "was not adequately tested before being sold."

Wow! I'd argue that nearly every bit of experience in this forum supports the plaintiffs' contention.

Even if the 12 volt system is deficient we know VW and Audi tested the snot out of it and that they know dang well what its weak points are.

And they decided to sell the cars anyway!

 

[NOVA49]

EVERY bit? Don’t think so.

 

[Atlant]

EVERY bit? Don’t think so.

Even the people that post about liking their cars usually mention one or two of the classic ID.4 problems and EVERYBODY has beens subject to the multiple ID.4 recalls.

 

[Spin]

Even the people that post about liking their cars usually mention one or two of the classic ID.4 problems and EVERYBODY has beens subject to the multiple ID.4 recalls.

There are long term owners on this forum who say they have never had even one issue. I'm not one of them.

 

[NOVA49]

There are long term owners on this forum who say they have never had even one issue. I'm not one of them.

I am.