Also, the EV expert said he only knew about a lengthy software update that takes about 10 hours, but that would not happen until - drumroll - JULY!!! I started laughing and was asked why. I said that VW originally announced the update for September 2021...

In a Reddit AMA a couple of weeks ago, Herbert Diess (CEO of VW Group) did answer a question about when software updates were coming for U.S. vehicles, and he answered that an update was coming this summer, so the EV person at the dealership's statement jibes with that.

Let's just hope they're both right, and the update actually comes in summer 2022 rather than later. I personally would rather have it come when it's fully vetted and truly ready, than have to deal with an update that's not ready for prime time

 

Let's just hope they're both right, and the update actually comes in summer 2022 rather than later

If I had to place a bet I would place it on the over.

 

Fortunately I really like the car in spite of the rather funky infotainment software, but it is kind of sad that the updates have turned into a running gag. I thought the whole point of OTA was so they could deliver a steady stream of incremental updates as they got the bugs worked out of the varied and different features. However, in the hands of VW it seems to have reverted back to a massive rewrite that can only be done at the dealer's shop. Oh well....

 

However, in the hands of VW it seems to have reverted back to a massive rewrite that can only be done at the dealer's shop

I would understand the (still disorganized) outcome if North American ID.4s were built in the new TN factory, which may have growing pains and used the wrong version of firmware in modules. Something where the firmware they're flashing to one or more components can't update itself, so someone has to pull it out and flash a new version manually. Been there and done that with Wifi arduino projects...

But these cars are made in the same damn German factory as the cars that have received software updates in Europe. I don't believe they were naive enough that the software on the car is split between the markets and not a configuration change. My curiosity is killing me, I really hope to know what caused them to screw up / delay the OTA in North America.

 

I suspect the 2.3 release turned out to have problems with deployment, making it a support headache. It never fixed all that much (more of a proof of concept I think), so they never brought it to the us market.

Nobody anywhere has 2.4 yet. Europe is waiting just like we are.

 

Deployment is key here.
I’m just afraid Verizon sold them on the “can you hear me now” and not on the “can you download me now”😁
Should have done like other car manufacturers and added Wi-Fi as an option…..at least!

 

...the EV expert said he only knew about a lengthy software update that takes about 10 hours, but that would not happen until - drumroll - JULY!!! I started laughing and was asked why. I said that VW originally announced the update for September 2021...

Do you think his July start date was him picking a random month that rhymes with "Summer" or do you think there's something that makes it smell official? I'm curious because if this battery + software is supposed to all happen at once (package 2 service issues into 1 visit) then getting the batteries out is going to be a big challenge and also very visible.

I'm still wistfully thinking Diess put out "summer" with the full expectation that they are going to make or beat that timeline. I know it's very general and technically doesn't begin until the end of June, but a guy can hope...

 

Do you think his July start date was him picking a random month that rhymes with "Summer" or do you think there's something that makes it smell official? I'm curious because if this battery + software is supposed to all happen at once (package 2 service issues into 1 visit) then getting the batteries out is going to be a big challenge and also very visible.

I'm still wistfully thinking Diess put out "summer" with the full expectation that they are going to make or beat that timeline. I know it's very general and technically doesn't begin until the end of June, but a guy can hope...

At this point my expectation is that it will be mid-late September (technically still "summer"). If it happens to be late June I will be pleasantly surprised.

 

I'm just hoping he means the summer of 2022

 

I'm still hoping we get it before the end of next month.

 

Me too, but I just know it's going to be a slog. First the announcement. Then waiting for the batteries to arrive. After that, booking the appointment. And since it takes a few hours, appointments are going to be scheduled out for months, at least around my area .

 

Considering all the disruptions caused by hardware suppliers in Ukraine going offline, I'll bet the software update gets pushed back several months.

 

I expect an announcement from VW indicating software updates sank on Felicity Ace, so we won't get it until summer 2023.

 

Has anyone confirmed the US 2022 models have the 3.0 software?

 

Can't confirm because as far as we know, no 2022s have been delivered yet.

 

i see my wife gives 2 buttons but when i press it for 10 seconds it doesn't reset. 😆

 

I generally just struggle to push the right buttons at the right time, but, on the other hand, I do excel at pushing the wrong buttons at the wrong time, and I guess that counts for something

 

Lucid has already pushed out 5 or 6 software updates in less than 2 months.
Kia and Hyundai have had a few.
We are sitting over a year and waiting😔

 

I believe we are in the unfortunate position of 2.x base code being poorly suited for OTAs. Perhaps VW would rather focus effort on future builds. Perhaps 2.x is so "patched together" – so delicate – that applying OTAs to it risks breaking something.

I know 3.x is close. I thought it was ready with the 2022 announcements, and have heard from a reliable source it's complete, but I'm questioning why we've not seen it, or seen a production '22 yet.

In any case, comparing to what other manufacturers are doing at this point is only going to make you mad. VW is going to do what it does at this point. I don't mean that in an "I've given up on OTAs" kinda of way. I'm mean that to say that VW has a road map, and they may have selected a slower route, or the longer route, and maybe they had some difficulties along the way, but they're definitely headed to OTAville and there's no changing course now.

 

I guess they had a few pallets of batteries destined for the US that were on the Felicity Ace and they have to reship.

 

Not anywhere near the frustration of current order holders who had to be re-fulfilled, but that could have been my 12V upgraded battery!! We're all in this together.

But the Fates and destiny had other plans.

 

Still waiting on a US delivery. I wonder if it'll be 2.1, 2.3, or delayed release until 3.1 is loaded.

 

Battery in the 2022

 

Here is a link to a speech by Hans Ulbricht on 3/2/22 (yesterday), on the changes to development at VW Group. It is not very informative, but one of his point is that the solution to the vehicle software problem is a new integrated platform called SSP that will emerge in 2026! I repeat 2026. They are currently still building the campus and team to even develop this platform. It is very depressing to see this company be so weak in the technology sector and unable to catch up.

Live stream

The Volkswagen Newsroom is a service of Volkswagen AG for journalists, bloggers, and multipliers. It offers the latest news for press and media.

www.volkswagen-newsroom.com

The video of the user trading in his id.4 for an Ioniq 5 may be a trend. And yes I know he said he loved his id.4, but just really wanted an Ioniq 5.

 

Here is a link to a speech by Hans Ulbricht on 3/2/22 (yesterday), on the changes to development at VW Group. It is not very informative, but one of his point is that the solution to the vehicle software problem is a new integrated platform called SSP that will emerge in 2026! I repeat 2026. They are currently still building the campus and team to even develop this platform. It is very depressing to see this company be so weak in the technology sector and unable to catch up.

Live stream

The Volkswagen Newsroom is a service of Volkswagen AG for journalists, bloggers, and multipliers. It offers the latest news for press and media.

www.volkswagen-newsroom.com

The video of the user trading in his id.4 for an Ioniq 5 may be a trend. And yes I know he said he loved his id.4, but just really wanted an Ioniq 5.

For the record, the Euro ID.4 software is perfectly acceptable and functional - some people may nok like the UI interactions, but the same can be said for Tesla, Ford and other auto manufacturers.

Again, again, i do not know what is cooking with VoA, but we have had consequential OTAs in Europe, and we are getting another soon that is expected to rectify and improve existing features.

VW needs to progress fast and in order to become a software company, they must vertically integrate and expand their in-house software development - and I see the new platform as future-proofing rather than the failure of the current platform (US aside).

VW has had more cojones than any other legacy automaker in terms of the strategic shift to BEVs, and they deserve some credit for trying, even when they falter.

That being said, and I have said it before, the US owner software experience leaves a lot to be desired.

 

The next platform architecture isn't new, VW has been talking about it as their next step as long as I've been on this board. In fact, at one point I was reading about looking two platforms ahead. This current platform has always been acknowledged to be a stepping stone. And this is true of any vehicle – there's always a next platform in the works.

So this isn't an "uh-oh," this has been an encouraging sign that VW is working diligently towards changing their ways and becoming a legitimate electric car builder.

The ID.4 was never meant to be the be-all / end-all, it's a step along the way.

 

@Pascal thanks for posting the pix (and your VIN in a different post). I checked PartsLink24 and it shows you have the same 000 915 105 DP battery with charge state indicator, filled and charged as the 2021 models, not the newer 000 915 105 FA Battery, filled and charged (ENHANCED FLOODED BATTERY) . Can you read any part numbers like those on yours?

 

I used to think that the 1996 Porsche 911 Targa was about as good as a Porsche could be, but thereafter came many more excellent "stepping stones" (as well as a very few toe stubs).
There's never a perfect mass produced vehicle, although some are far better than others. So take a holistic view of your ID driving experience, recognizing there could be improvements but likely won't be of a really major magnitude.
If it serves you well today, great. If not, consider your next vehicle. There's always a next vehicle. 😉

 

Excellent point!

What the SSP will do for VW is take a bunch of their learned experience -- including mistakes and lessons learned from MEB -- folded in with their desire to have an architecture that can underpin a wider variety of brands and vehicle types. It will undoubtedly simplify the MEB, which has a bunch of legacy modules hanging off of it, and in the end allow VW to build more cars, more easily, more profitably.

That doesn't mean MEB is a slouch. It IS a purposefully-designed EV platform, it has great build quality, and I don't think the suspension or driving performance or cabin quality is at all inferior to what's ahead -- or in other words, it's what VW intended a vehicle should be for this class and at this price point.

The MEB is more complex under the hood than it needs to be. But that part was out of necessity -- VW wanted to take systems they already have on the road and redeploy them in this new platform, so as to not have to build completely from the ground up. So the software is proving to be the headache, because they chose to hang on to this complexity, in order to get a product to market.

So when SSP rolls out in four more years, it'll look different from the driver's seat, and the software will feel different, and it will surely be easier for VW to update, but I doubt the driving experience will be at all different.

Mechatronics

...

www.volkswagenag.com

 

So the software is proving to be the headache, because they chose to hang on to this complexity, in order to get a product to market.

Ulbricht stressed the need to prioritize the safety of vehicles, so inclusion of open-source code would be very limited.

I heard the excuse in the VW video that you have to consider safety first, but I don't think Ford or Tesla cut corners on safety.

VW's approach to this must be understood within the context of the raging right to repair disputes that are currently erupting across various developed countries. They've taken significant steps in the past to lock their software down in ways that have nothing to do with safety issues. Andy might be willing to speak to that issue from the perspective of an aftermarket service provider.

I asked if VW even cares about software updates on the ID4.

Right question, wrong way to ask it. The issue, at least for US customers, is what is VWoA's commitment to US owners. VW doesn't drop support for their vehicles globally they just tend to leave US customers holding the bag.

For the record, the Euro ID.4 software is perfectly acceptable and functional - some people may nok like the UI interactions, but the same can be said for Tesla, Ford and other auto manufacturers.

Again, again, i do not know what is cooking with VoA, but we have had consequential OTAs in Europe, and we are getting another soon that is expected to rectify and improve existing features.

case in point

 

I asked Kyle Conner any word on I.D4 update…. He said yep!…a lot of words😁
He still hopes to get a hold of it soon.

I asked if VW even cares about software updates on the ID4. He emphatically says YES. Still can’t go into detail on what he knows. He’s doing a live stream today and I wished I had watched more because he said that he had been talking about the subject at length.

 

A rather relevant article from Reuters, via InsideEVs, on the topic of OTAs.

I have a lot of respect for Tesla's role in pushing us all in a more sustainable direction and for being the guide for all other auto manufacturers in this regard, but Tesla is unique in its development approach and structure, for better and worse, and the Tesla-way of doing things might not necessarily be the right way for other manufacturers - and it may just explain why VW is taking its merry time to get things OTA'ed after a hectic first (and flawed) release of their software platform to avoid emissions fines in Europe.

And this article, I think, covers the matter rather well in its breakdown of pros and cons of the Tesla-way of doing software:

Tesla Software Updates Speed Up Recalls, But May Increase Risks

Tesla had far fewer recalls than most automakers over the last two years, and most were handled by over-the-air software updates. What are the risks involved?

insideevs.com

 

A rather relevant article from Reuters, via InsideEVs, on the topic of OTAs.

I have a lot of respect for Tesla's role in pushing us all in a more sustainable direction and for being the guide for all other auto manufacturers in this regards, but Tesla is unique in its development approach and structure, for better and worse, and the Tesla-way of doing things might not necessarily be the right way for other manufacturers - and it may just explain why VW is taking its merry time to get things OTA'ed after a hectic first (and flawed) release of their software platform to avoid emissions fines in Europe.

And this article, I think, covers the matter rather well in its breakdown of pros and cons of the Tesla-way of doing software:

Tesla Software Updates Speed Up Recalls, But May Increase Risks

Tesla had far fewer recalls than most automakers over the last two years, and most were handled by over-the-air software updates. What are the risks involved?

insideevs.com

Ford is doing a lot with OTAs also. My wife's Mach-e seems to be getting updates monthly. I have not heard much from the other major EV companies, but I suspect VW is the only one that currently does NOT do OTAs.

I heard the excuse in the VW video that you have to consider safety first, but I don't think Ford or Tesla cut corners on safety. And not having the ability to OTA means that if do they find a safety concern today in the car the only recourse is to physically recall the cars to repair them. With a product as complex as a BEV that is essentially a fly-by-wire machine, not having OTA might be considered a safety exposure.

 

You are very misinformed. OTA is not a safety feature. If there was a safety or drivability problem with ID.4's, they would all be recalled to a workshop.

There are firm plans for the 3.0 OTA.

 

You are very misinformed. OTA is not a safety feature. If there was a safety or drivability problem with ID.4's, they would all be recalled to a workshop.

There are firm plans for the 3.0 OTA.

Sure there are firm plans for a 3.0 OTA....Maybe in 2030!!!

 

I wonder if this guy still has a job and/or regrets what he said last summer.

Ralf Brandstätter, CEO of the Volkswagen Passenger Cars brand: “Volkswagen is moving up a gear when it comes to digitalisation. After the successful roll-out of our all-electric ID. family, the brand is once again leading the movement: we are creating a totally new, digital customer experience with new functions and greater comfort – every twelve weeks. This makes us the first high-volume manufacturer to regularly deliver extensive Over-the-Air Updates. This is an important milestone in the implementation of our ACCELERATE strategy, which is preparing Volkswagen for the connected, digital mobility of the future.”

 

Lol, I don't know, maybe he didn't get his verb tense correct at one point, but I can read this and see "twelve weeks" and get all giddy, or I can read it a bit more holistically and see that he referenced they are embarking on a new phase and only making vague aspirational promises.

we are creating [FUTURE TENSE] a totally new, digital customer experience​

​

with new functions and greater comfort – every twelve weeks [BY EXTENSION, FUTURE TENSE].​

​

This makes us [PRESENT TENSE] the first high-volume manufacturer​

​

to regularly deliver extensive Over-the-Air Updates.​

​

This [RE: TOTALLY NEW, DIGITAL CUSTOMER EXPERIENCE WE ARE CREATING] is an important milestone​

​

in the implementation of our ACCELERATE strategy, which is preparing [FUTURE TENSE]​

​

Volkswagen for the connected, digital mobility of the future.​

No, I'm not an English or grammar teacher. I wish VW was more communicative. I wish they would just own the delays. But my main takeaway continues to be that VW is working towards bettering this product. They have not given up on us.

 

I always find it funny to read these debates about software OTA and those pretending to know these big secrets and others getting frustrated as if the lack of OTA's is like they bought a car and it doesn't have a steering wheel. My ID4 has been fantastic. My Iphone, my Mac, my windows computer frequently get updates and rarely do I get something that I'm remotely interested in. It worked fine before and now it still works fine... So I suspect at some point there will be an update and the car will drive just like it did before and now many people will be angry because they had certain fantasies and what they got didn't match with their hopes and dreams. Enjoy your car, it's awesome, if you hate it sell it and get something else. Life's too short to spend it worrying about your car's software.

 

My Iphone, my Mac, my windows computer frequently get updates and rarely do I get something that I'm remotely interested in.

Some of the coming updates are things that were expected to work from the get go like scheduled charging. This is a big deal for some folks that don't have smart EVSEs. I'm looking forward to faster DC charging and plug and play. Auto hold is another item that is high on most people's lists. Most, if not all of this will be in the upcoming 3.1 OTA update, along with a more useful nav. This will be done at the dealer in a 3 step process (2.3, 2,4, 3.1) along with a new battery, maybe EFB or AGM.